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Text 1727, 248 rader
Skriven 2005-01-02 19:19:16 av Rich (1:379/45)
   Kommentar till text 1724 av Ellen K. (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Usage history
=========================

From: "Rich" <@>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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   Doing what?  Tracking their ads and the users that view them?  No =
doubt.  Are there many ad networks that don't?

   www.google.com assigns each user a cookie that looks to have a unique =
ID value.  How much do you think this has affected its popularity?  Do = you
think they are using cookies for your benefit or theirs?

Rich

  "Ellen K." <72322.enno.esspeayem.1016@compuserve.com> wrote in message =
news:9naht0dog7hmlkk8s6p88h8iscl7ralnho@4ax.com...
  I hate doubleclick.  The worst thing is that they are so ubiquitous,
  even sites I would expect to be honorable, like Charles Schwab, have
  doubleclick in places.  I never take their cookies but I think they =
are
  doing something anyway.

  On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 16:50:38 -0800, "Rich" <@> wrote in message
  <41d894a5@w3.nls.net>:

  >   Cookies can not be PII unless you supply the PII.  That makes them =
interesting for marketing purposes but meaningless to identify someone.  = And
still, it is the client wholely in control.  I never persist = doubleclick
cookies.  In my usage I never honor them at all.
  >
  >   Contrary to what you say, identifying yourself in a purchase does =
not make their history available to doubleclick.  If your purchase is = not
from doubleclick then they have no clue a purchase occured at all = unless the
folks from whom you are purchasing are giving away or selling = your PII. 
Similarly, the folks from whome you purchase, unless = doubleclick itself, have
no idea what your doubleclick identity is = unless doubleclick is providing
this to them.  And even if all this = happened, you can just delete your local
cookies and any cookie only = identity goes away.
  >
  >   I don't know why you mentioned jetblue or claim they were fingered =
by cookies.  The story to which you refer makes no such claim.  It's = claims
are quite clear and quite different.
  >
  >Rich
  >
  >  "Mike N." <mike@u-spam-u-die.net> wrote in message =
news:vqrgt0dte9q55j7bq5bbuoi230b6f5cu2v@4ax.com...
  >  On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 13:17:36 -0800, "Rich" <@> wrote:
  >
  >  >   All this is paranoia about what someone could do and has never =
been about what actually is done.
  >  >
  >  >   Continuing with your paranoia, cookies and auth events are not =
available in any single location.  Cookies require you to go to each and =
every client,
  >
  >    Central ad servers such as DoubleClick are repositories for =
cookie and
  >  individual tracking  information through the referrer and =
site-specific ad
  >  trigger.   Now whenever someone identifies themselves through a =
purchase,
  >  their entire personally-identifiable history is available from =
DoubleClick.
  >  This is the default cookie configuration which 95% of the =
population never
  >  adjusts or purges.   So while cookie information is not available =
in any
  >  single location, it takes only  collaboration by  2-3 sites to =
reveal all
  >  the cards.
  >
  >    Continuing onto what has actually been done: 1,500,000 people =
have been
  >  fingered by cookies under the guise of Homeland Security - Airline
  >  Passenger Risk Assesment.
  >
  >  http://www.computer.org/security/V2n6/anton.htm
  >
  >  "Torch's homeland security report explains that it matched the =
JetBlue
  >  passenger information database with information purchased from =
Acxiom to
  >  determine gender, home specifics (renter or owner), years at =
residence,
  >  income, number of children, adult SSNs, occupations, vehicles =
owned, and so
  >  on, for 40 percent of the passengers in the database.2 Torch =
leveraged the
  >  information JetBlue provided (which it claimed was limited) into a =
much
  >  larger information corpus by purchasing demographic information =
from Acxiom
  >  to augment the database."
  >
  >    It took only 4 organizations: JetBlue, Acxiom, ???(unknown 3rd =
party),
  >  and Torch to pull off this fiasco. =20

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.1289" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Doing what?&nbsp; Tracking =
their ads=20
and the users that view them?&nbsp; No doubt.&nbsp; Are there many ad =
networks=20
that don't?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; <A=20
href=3D"http://www.google.com">www.google.com</A> assigns each user a = cookie
that=20
looks to have a unique ID value.&nbsp; How much do you think this has =
affected=20
its popularity?&nbsp; Do you think they are using cookies for your = benefit
or=20
theirs?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV>"Ellen K." &lt;<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:72322.enno.esspeayem.1016@compuserve.com">72322.enno.esspe=
ayem.1016@compuserve.com</A>&gt;=20
  wrote in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:9naht0dog7hmlkk8s6p88h8iscl7ralnho@4ax.com">news:9naht0dog7h=
mlkk8s6p88h8iscl7ralnho@4ax.com</A>...</DIV>I=20
  hate doubleclick.&nbsp; The worst thing is that they are so=20
  ubiquitous,<BR>even sites I would expect to be honorable, like Charles =
Schwab,=20
  have<BR>doubleclick in places.&nbsp; I never take their cookies but I =
think=20
  they are<BR>doing something anyway.<BR><BR>On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 16:50:38 =
-0800,=20
  "Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message<BR>&lt;<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:41d894a5@w3.nls.net">41d894a5@w3.nls.net</A>&gt;:<BR><BR>&=
gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  Cookies can not be PII unless you supply the PII.&nbsp; That makes =
them=20
  interesting for marketing purposes but meaningless to identify =
someone.&nbsp;=20
  And still, it is the client wholely in control.&nbsp; I never persist=20
  doubleclick cookies.&nbsp; In my usage I never honor them at=20
  all.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Contrary to what you say, identifying =

  yourself in a purchase does not make their history available to=20
  doubleclick.&nbsp; If your purchase is not from doubleclick then they =
have no=20
  clue a purchase occured at all unless the folks from whom you are =
purchasing=20
  are giving away or selling your PII.&nbsp; Similarly, the folks from =
whome you=20
  purchase, unless doubleclick itself, have no idea what your =
doubleclick=20
  identity is unless doubleclick is providing this to them.&nbsp; And =
even if=20
  all this happened, you can just delete your local cookies and any =
cookie only=20
  identity goes away.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't know why you =
mentioned=20
  jetblue or claim they were fingered by cookies.&nbsp; The story to =
which you=20
  refer makes no such claim.&nbsp; It's claims are quite clear and quite =

  different.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Rich<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; "Mike N." &lt;<A=20
  href=3D"mailto:mike@u-spam-u-die.net">mike@u-spam-u-die.net</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
  message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:vqrgt0dte9q55j7bq5bbuoi230b6f5cu2v@4ax.com">news:vqrgt0dte9q=
55j7bq5bbuoi230b6f5cu2v@4ax.com</A>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 13:17:36 -0800, "Rich" &lt;@&gt;=20
  wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; All this is paranoia =
about what=20
  someone could do and has never been about what actually is =
done.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Continuing with your paranoia, =
cookies and=20
  auth events are not available in any single location.&nbsp; Cookies =
require=20
  you to go to each and every client,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Central=20
  ad servers such as DoubleClick are repositories for cookie =
and<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  individual tracking&nbsp; information through the referrer and =
site-specific=20
  ad<BR>&gt;&nbsp; trigger.&nbsp;&nbsp; Now whenever someone identifies=20
  themselves through a purchase,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; their entire=20
  personally-identifiable history is available from =
DoubleClick.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  This is the default cookie configuration which 95% of the population=20
  never<BR>&gt;&nbsp; adjusts or purges.&nbsp;&nbsp; So while cookie =
information=20
  is not available in any<BR>&gt;&nbsp; single location, it takes =
only&nbsp;=20
  collaboration by&nbsp; 2-3 sites to reveal all<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the=20
  cards.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Continuing onto what has =
actually=20
  been done: 1,500,000 people have been<BR>&gt;&nbsp; fingered by =
cookies under=20
  the guise of Homeland Security - Airline<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Passenger Risk=20
  Assesment.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.computer.org/security/V2n6/anton.htm">http://www.compu=
ter.org/security/V2n6/anton.htm</A><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  "Torch's homeland security report explains that it matched the=20
  JetBlue<BR>&gt;&nbsp; passenger information database with information=20
  purchased from Acxiom to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; determine gender, home =
specifics=20
  (renter or owner), years at residence,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; income, number of =

  children, adult SSNs, occupations, vehicles owned, and =
so<BR>&gt;&nbsp; on,=20
  for 40 percent of the passengers in the database.2 Torch leveraged=20
  the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; information JetBlue provided (which it claimed was =
limited)=20
  into a much<BR>&gt;&nbsp; larger information corpus by purchasing =
demographic=20
  information from Acxiom<BR>&gt;&nbsp; to augment the=20
  database."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; It took only 4 =
organizations:=20
  JetBlue, Acxiom, ???(unknown 3rd party),<BR>&gt;&nbsp; and Torch to =
pull off=20
  this fiasco.&nbsp; <BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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