Text 3550, 130 rader
Skriven 2006-07-07 14:22:00 av Robert E Starr JR (4023.babylon5)
Ärende: Re: Atheists: America's m
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* * * This message was from Kurt Ullman to rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.m * * *
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@MSGID: <kurtullman-2EBB06.18561306072006@news.west.earthlink.net>
@REPLY: <cemfa2pl698vnkdpfkl6hsjrm4qedts632@4ax.com>
In article <0001HW.C0D2F66E00DF0698F0284530@news.verizon.net>,
 Amy Guskin <aisling@fjordstone.com> wrote:

> >> On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 13:45:36 -0400, Kurt Ullman wrote
> (in article <kurtullman-4586A2.13453506072006@news.west.earthlink.net>):
> 
> > In article <1152195870.122796.120610@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> >  "ravend03x" <rkimd3@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> >> 
> >> When you start with setting insurance rates by virtue of a patient's
> >> weight, you start getting into bias against those who live at lower
> >> incomes.
> >   Not really. It is still possible to eat well even with the cheaper 
> > foods available. <<
> 
> Kurt, there have been _so_ many studies on this, and feature article after 
> feature article that I've read in just about every publication I've perused 
> in the past several years.  It's all well and good to say that the single 
> mother of five in a marginal urban area, who works two jobs, should take her 
> meager salary and limited time and buy produce and rice and stuff and cook 
> for her kids; in actuality, what usually happens is the kids order off the 
> dollar menu at McDonald's.  Which gives you fat kids, diabetes on the rise, 
> etc. etc.
        
       So, we just write them off and pat them on the head and send them 
to an early grave?   I am wondering if the changes in the dollar menu at 
McD's and similar places would make a difference, then. I also wonder if 
the existance of the healthier stuff is taken advantage of or if they 
stay with the lousy choices even when the other stuff is available? 
      Actually portion control may be at least as important in this. 
"Larger portion sizes of foods low in fat and commercial energy-dense 
foods and beverages could be important factors in maintaining a high 
energy intake, causing over-consumption and enhancing the prevalence of 
obesity in the population. In light of this development, portion size 
ought to take central place in dietary guidelines and public campaigns."
     Portion size was an important determinant of obesity even within 
the cheaper items.

    The French also have noted that it is possible to eat healthier even 
on low cost meals. 
For the lowest cost diet (ie, 3.18 euros/d), marked changes from the 
"mean observed diet" were required, including a marked reduction in the 
amount of energy from fresh fruits (-85%) and green vegetables (-70%), 
and an increase in the amount of energy from nuts, dried fruits, roots, 
legumes, and fruit juices. IMPLICATIONS: Nutrition education for 
low-income French women must emphasize these affordable food choices.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt
=Abstract&list_uids=16595286&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_DocSum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt
=Abstract&list_uids=12581467&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_DocSum
   There are also a few emerging studies suggesting, that even with 
lower socioeconomic strata (doncha just love sociologist-speak), 
education may influence this, too. 
   "In the lower social class group, overall food knowledge appeared 
superior in the leaner subject group (BMI<30 kg/m2)." 
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt
=Abstract&list_uids=16030520&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_DocSum

Another article suggested that "a diet that meets all of the nutritional 
recommendations need not cost much can be illustrated by the Thrifty 
Food Plan, a low cost food plan developed by the U.S. Department of 
Agriculture that meets current nutritional standards (including Food 
Guide Pyramid servings recommendations) and can therefore be considered 
a "healthy" diet (16 ). Compared with the average diet in 19891991, the 
Thrifty Food Plan included more grains, vegetables, fruit and dairy and 
less fats, oils and meats (Fig. 3 ). In February 2002, the Thrifty Food 
Plan cost an estimated $107/wk for a family of four (17 ), or 
approximately $3.80 per person per day." This is close to the French 
diet suggested above in cost .
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt
=Abstract&list_uids=12612166&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_DocSum

  Finally I suggest this rather interesting review article.
http://jn.nutrition.org:80/cgi/content/full/135/4/905
    Among the more interesting findings is one that suggestion portion 
size is an important distinguishing factor for obesity even in cheaper 
diets.
     What all this means, is that we shouldn't just write off these 
folks. 


> It's just not a practical reality for some people.
   Of course it is with some education and work and jumping up and down 
on Wendy's and McD's etc. 

> 
> >> Also, exercise plays at least as big a role in weight 
> > reduction at normal intakes. <<
> 
> I think the schools have some responsibility for this.  Whatever happened to 
> that "President's Council on Physical Fitness" that was such a big deal when 
> I was growing up in the 60s and 70s?  They used to encourage exercise, give 
> out awards, etc.  Is that still around?
      Yep. However, much of this is now done outside of schools because 
of the downsizing, as it were, of Phys Ed. Monetary in some areas, being 
crowded out by academic requirements, problems with liability (falls off 
jungle jims or concussions from dodgeballs) have all gotten together. 


>
> Obesity and poverty _are_ linked; studies have clearly shown this.
> 
> From 
>
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abst
> ract&list_uids=14684391&query_h%09l=1:
> 
> "First, the highest rates of obesity occur among population groups with the 
> highest poverty rates and the least education."
> 
> From http://www.hungeractionnys.org/ObPovCSAs.pdf:
> 
> "Public health professionals have established a significant link between 
> being overweight and obese and being poor.  Obesity in America is, to a large

> extent, an economic issue."
> 
> That's just with a cursory search.
>   
    I think I addressed most of this above.
     
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