Text 511, 109 rader
Skriven 2006-05-25 07:54:00 av Robert E Starr JR (957.babylon5)
Ärende: Re: War Without End, Part
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* * * This message was from Eric Gillespie to rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.m * * *
         * * * and has been forwarded to you by Lord Time * * *         
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@MSGID: <87ejyoi6ps.fsf@wundagore.diplodocus.org>
@REPLY: <1147584332.514006.173100@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>
> On Sat, 20 May 2006 21:57:10 +0000 (UTC), Jan <janmschroeder@aol.com>
> wrote:
>
>>In article <87psi9i8sp.fsf@wundagore.diplodocus.org>, Eric Gillespie says...
>>>
>>>I don't.  The dynastic aspect of Babylon 5 always annoyed me, and
>>>i was very disappointed that the only criticism we ever saw
>>>turned out to be mind control.  Naturally!  No hero would
>>>question our savior!
>>
>>Not quite.  What Bester had done to Garibaldi was to enhance his
>>natural tendancy toward suspicion.  Remember, even Bester was
>>surprised when Garibaldi left his job as Chief of Security.

The only time Garibaldi offered the criticism i yearned to see
someone voice was while under Bester's influence.  After that was
removed, he fell right back into line.  I'll give him the benefit
of the doubt, though; maybe he was still skeptical of what was
going on, but felt so bad about his betrayal that he suppressed
these thoughts.

>>>Sheridan and Delenn had no more respect for the other races than
>>>the Vorlons or Shadows had.  Sheridan manipulated the non-aligned
>>>worlds into accepting White Star patrols.  Then he didn't have
>>>the faith in and respect for them to step aside as president, as
>>>Washington had.  He went on to create a mythic death to "make it
>>>a little easier for [Delenn] to keep the others in line."
>>
>>He manipulated them into accepting the patrols, yes.  But that
>>didn't automatically assure that they'd ever accept the InterStellar
>>Alliance.  You have to admit that it's a pretty big leap and one
>>that really was almost taken too soon because the alliance was
>>almost broken at the first sign of trouble.

Of course i admit that, and it's a shame Sheridan couldn't or
wouldn't see that himself.  I am criticizing his hypocritical,
Vorlonesque manipulation, not denigrating the efforts of the
other races.  That they formed the Alliance of their own free
will does not justify Sheridan's actions; quite the opposite.

Wesley Struebing <strueb@carpedementem.org> writes:

> And, while his "death" (or at least disappearence) attained mythic
> proportions later on, he didn't create it (or was Lorien Sheridan's
> creation, too?).

I think his own words were quite damning; whatever Lorien did is
irrelevant.  Sheridan wanted to keep the other races in line.

> And he DID step aside - of his own volition.

Heh, i'd forgotten he was no longer president at his death until
i read this.  I looked it up, and see that two years before he
refused re-election.  But come on, switching from President to
Entil'zha is hardly stepping aside.

Jan again:

>>>David Sheridan taking over the Grey Council?  Bah.  If Delenn had
>>>wanted to make a real change after the Minbari civil war, she
>>>would have instituted representative democracy.
>>
>>I don't think that Minbar would have been anywhere near ready to
>>accept that.

This is exactly the attitude i am criticizing in Sheridan and
friends.  It is the same attitude they claimed to find
reprehensible in the Shadows and Vorlons.  It is not your place,
not the First Ones' place, and not Delenn's place to decide when
the Minbari are ready for this.

They're adults.  They manage not only to run their own lives, but
to keep a technological civilization running for a thousand
years.  I think they can handle it.

Would they make mistakes, screw it up?  No doubt.  Are we doing
any differently here in the real world?

>>A society whose focus was on serving society rather than personal
>>fulfilment sounds like it would be ideal, doesn't it?  Except that
>>they were also perfectly accepting of being "...told what they
>>needed to know, and no more."

That sounds like a significant portion of the American
population.

Since i'm only a regular lurker, not poster (this might be my 5th
or 6th post since i started lurking here in 1995), i should
clarify.  I'm a huge fan of B5 and jms.  I'm criticizing the
characters here, not the show.  I find these actions and
attitudes quite believable and in character.

My only disappointment is that no significant dissenting voice
ever arose.  I think this would have been a great thread to
explore in season 5.  It certainly would have been more
interesting than the Telegoth story ;->.

-- 
Eric Gillespie <*> epg@pretzelnet.org
                                                                               
                                   
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