Text 41330, 145 rader
Skriven 2006-10-15 20:00:10 av Björn Forsström (2:203/614.61)
  Kommentar till text 41280 av JEFF SMITH (1:282/1031)
Ärende: DUD-file
================

 BF>> And you still haven't answered my question (don't think I ever will get
 BF>> one either) and as long as you are only questioning one side I don't see
 BF>> you as impartial.

 JS>     I am questioning Michiel about his reasons for the use of the
 JS> copyright
 JS> because HE is the one that is playing the copyright game. Who else would I
 JS> ask?

If you had been aware of the history behind it you wouldn't have had to ask
and as far as I have read he already have explanied it and the first time I saw
it I knew what the response would be and this "game" can also be seen as a
response to what Roy did, writing in others name and that didn't even get 10%
of the noice that this did and I believe that that was far worse than this.

 JS> If you are referring to me questioning or taking to task Shannon for
 JS> his conflicts with Bjorn and the alleged illegal stuff on Bjorn's website.
 JS> That is a separate issue.

Somehow it isn't.

 JS> Michiel is trying to link the two issues with
 JS> his copyright game. Where have I criticized or even discussed the matter
 JS> of Bjorn's website with either Shannon or Bjorn? I haven't. My primary but
 JS> not only reason for not saying anything is that I was not active or around
 JS> at the time and did not know or understand enough of the situation about
 JS> Bjorn's website to form an opinion either way. I have since formed a
 JS> limited opinion based on the confrontation of both Shannon and Bjorn that
 JS> I have been privy too. But don't know enough to feel justified taking
 JS> sides. My opinion is that if Bjorn has/had illegal or copyrighted material
 JS> on his website. Then the applicable law should be enforced and he should
 JS> pay whatever price that the law requires. Regardless, I don't see the
 JS> point of arguing the matter here in this echo.

If you take what everyone here says and divide it by 2 you will come nearer
the truth and the point is that the laws in your country doesn't apply here and
that is what Michiel have been trying to say all the time and so far Felten
haven't
been convicted in any court so why keeping that up beats me?

 JS>     I could ask you the same thing regarding not talking to Michiel about
 JS> the damage his copyright game has caused. But I will not as I don't think
 JS> it is necessary and besides it would be a rather silly question.

As I said, to me he already have explanied it.

 JS> I have
 JS> pretty much resigned myself to the fact that it would not be politically
 JS> correct for you or Bjorn to see me as impartial or reasonable regardless
 JS> of what I say or who I talk too.

Hey, welcome to Fidonews. The echo where everyone takes cheap shots at
everyone, the worse the better. Didn't you read my letter to the editor?

 BF>>>> Until you do you will only increase the Z1 vs. Z2
 BF>>>> thing  because now it's Z1 vs. Michiel and that isn't fair

 JS>>>      But you have to take into account Michiel's many statements right
 JS>>> here in this echo about his dislike of Z1 ways, Americans, Etc. When
 JS>>> enough people from Z1 keep seeing that opinion expressed by Michiel they
 JS>>> are bound to feel some degree of animosity.

 BF>> So far I haven't seen much of his dislike of America or Americans, only
 BF>> about doing it the Z1 way.
 BF>> And you haven't seen the many statements from the rest of the world what
 BF>> they think about doing it the Z1 way?

 JS>       Yup. There seems to be only a few from Z2 that have a significant
 JS> issue with the so called Z1 way.

Only a few? I haven't seen one that agrees with you.

 JS> If there are others they don't seem to
 JS> think it enough of a concern to say anything.

Like those in Z1 that doesn't agree with Roy and Shannon.

 JS> Personally I think that the
 JS> Zx way of thinking is pointless. But thinking that way is not the Z2 way
 JS> <g>

*I* understand you and think the same but unfortunatly we are the only one.

 JS>>> I have asked Michiel several
 JS>>> times why he feels the need to look at the group as being bad when only
 JS>>> a
 JS>>> handfull of that group are in a conflict with Michiel.

 BF>> So long as this group gets away with eveything they do without being
 BF>> qustioned by anyone in Z1 (including you) they clearly speaks for
 BF>> everyone in Z1.

 JS>      Now that's a cop out Bjorn. So long as a few gets away with
 JS> everything that they do here. They speak for everyone?

So it apperas so long as no one says against them.

 JS> Who is letting them get away with everything?

You for one. I have tried with my park bench and see where that led.
Me getting shit for it.

 JS> Who is the person responsible for talking to them and
 JS> getting them to stop? You are asking me to do what the moderator SHOULD be
 JS> doing but isn't and doesn't want to.

You have read his answer and as you said yourself above, he have resigned.

 JS>     Roy, Shannon, Frank, me, Tom, Harry, Dick no more speak for zone 1
 JS> than you, Bjorn, or Michiel speak for zone 2.

The loudest rooster in the chicken farm gets to do all the screwing......

 JS>>>      There are some that enjoy the verbal dueling and use most any
 JS>>> opportunity to play the button pushing game.

 BF>> I've said it before, go after them as well and tell them what you think
 BF>> about their behaviour too.

I see that you didn't answer this one.

 JS>>>      I have tried a number of times to understand both sides. I have
 JS>>> questioned people on both sides to better understand the matter from
 JS>>> both
 JS>>> points of view.

 BF>> Where, when, with whom?

I see that you didn't answer this one either.

 JS>>> Michiel has pretty much refused to say what his reasons were or answer
 JS>>> some basic questions. His attitude was that if I didn't already know
 JS>>> then it was just too bad. That type of attitude only allows
 JS>>> for a limited understanding.

 BF>> That's just how the rest of the world feels about Roy, Shannon and Frank
 BF>> as well. Same shit, different places.

 JS>    Same shit, different places, different attitudes.

Of course.

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 * Origin: . (2:203/614.61)