Text 33993, 97 rader
Skriven 2009-07-01 06:43:40 av Robert Bashe (2:2448/44)
  Kommentar till text 33961 av Roy Witt (1:397/22)
Ärende: green fuel
==================
Roy Witt wrote to Robert Bashe on Tuesday June 30 2009 at 12:00:

RW>>> One thing for sure. They don't store hydrogen fuel at a refueling
RW>>> station, they make it on the spot when it's required by a customer.

RB>> Now you really are joking :-)

RW> I keep telling you to do the research...if anyone is joking, it'd be
RW> the people who've invented this stuff, not me.

Why should I dig into something I don't believe, but you claim? Let you do the
work if you want to be believed.

RB>> How would you suggest that be done?

RW> Take a look at the Honda home station. It makes hydrogen while the
RW> owner waits at the breakfast table, sipping on his coffee.

Nice system: a portable nuclear reactor to split water into hydrogen and
oxygen, and the driver even gets the oxygen to breathe to give himself a high
;-) Next joke?

RB>> Practically speaking, it's not possible in the quantities required
RB>> for fuel.

RW> That's what you think.

RB>> Electrolysis is too equipmnent-intensive, power-intensive and slow,
RB>> use of metal hydrides much too expensive and unsafe in the hands of
RB>> laypersons - and what else?

RW> That's odd, Bob - they already exist...

They? And note the reference above was to the use in a filling station and
NOT!!! to industrial facilities for production of hydrogen.

RB>> No, some kind of storage would be the only practical way of handling
RB>> hydrogen as a fuel - and would be accompanied by safety risks much
RB>> higher than those in conventional filling stations.

RW> Which is as ass-backwards as a muzzle-loading rifle today.

I think I'd rather have a muzzle loader with powder and balls than a machine
gun without cartridges, just to reply with your own metaphor.

RW>>> LOL! The price for a bank of batteries is around $3000...and they
RW>>> can't be swapped out in a filling station.

RB>> Can't they? Then they have something in common with hydrogen-powered
RB>> cars: impractical except in limited environments.

RW> The big difference is, you can't charge a battery pack in 5 or 6
RW> minutes, while you can manufacture enough hydrogen fuel to power a
RW> hydrogen vehicle for 300 miles, on the spot in that amount of time.

;-)) Sure, sure. Go right ahead.

RB>> By the way, one of the local pharmacies in Datteln has had an
RB>> electric-powered car for years, presumably for local deliveries.

RW> That's wonderful...he's polluting the air by plugging it into the
RW> grid. Which is generated by burning fossil fuels. That's no better
RW> than a normal car running on gasoline.

So how else are electric cars supposed to run? And how are you supposed to
produce hydrogen without inputting energy? In the end, everything boils right
down to the same thing. But I might note that there is also a lot of
hydroelectric power around, at least here.

RB>> The pharmacist once ran out of "juice" near my house and asked me if
RB>> he could use an electric socket in my garage to charge his battery
RB>> enough to get back to his base. No problem - it took about an hour
RB>> and then he was off again.

RW> What a big waste of time. You could have given him a gallon of water
RW> and he could have made his own hydrogen and driven off in less than 5
RW> minutes.

Jeez, Roy, do you believe _everything_ people claim? If things were that easy,
we'd have no use for that black stuff that comes out of the ground in the
Middle East and Texas. This is beginning to sound like the "cold fusion" hype
in the early 1990s.

RB>> Naturally, this car isn't something you'd take the family out for a
RB>> ride in - just a small thing, looks a little like a racing car (long
RB>> and low), but for short hauls it does the job: in a limited
RB>> environment, as described.

RW> I laugh everytime I pass one of those things. Kinda like the hare and
RW> the tortoise story.

Maybe, but that's state of the art and nothing better has yet been presented.

Cheers, Bob

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