Text 25489, 131 rader
Skriven 2012-02-20 09:50:54 av Robert Bashe (2:2448/44)
  Kommentar till text 25366 av Ward Dossche (2:292/854)
Ärende: question after reading conf for several days
====================================================
Ward Dossche wrote to Robert Bashe on Friday February 17 2012 at 18:32:

The "Reinheitsgebot"...
RB>> And was introduced in 1516 specifically to prevent Belgian
RB>> competitors (who didn't exist then any more than Belgium did) from
RB>> selling beer in Germany (which also didn't exist as a country at the
RB>> time - the law was passed in the Kingdom of Bavaria). Sure.

WD> ... and the purpose to push other brews from the trade. It's
WD> preserving one's own market, happens all the time.

Sorry, I wasn't around in 1516 and thus don't know precisely why the
Reinheitsgebot was introduced. In those days, I would presume the reason was
more to eliminate contamination than to reduce competition, since "competition"
in those days would hardly have been international or even widespread (lousy
communication, poor roads, no refrigeration and remember, beer doesn't keep
forever).

Oh, yes, and competition was regulated by the guild system in those days,
anyway.

RB>> One can, same as one can define "beer" as any yellowish fizzy water
RB>> with a bitter taste and 3-6% alcohol, while at the same time adopting
RB>> fried potatoes as a national dish. Notice the dig? ;-)

WD> Actually ... no ... fried potatoes can be a national dish in South
WD> America, but never here.

So? Then why have you, among many others, always praised the Belgian "frites"
in the highest terms? A little like the Germans and their Currywurst...

WD> On that subject, it's quite interesting to learn what people ate in
WD> the 14- and 15-hundreds before potatoes were a staple here. Friend of
WD> mine, ex-sysop Jozef Schildermans, has written a book about medieval
WD> cooking.

If it were authentic, I wouldn't want to eat anything made with one of the
recipes. They were forever having waves of food poisoning and stuff like Saint
Anthony's Fire (ergotism caused by contaminated grain).

But in another vein, it's interesting to read about how the introduction of
potatoes to Europe led to a population explosion because of the increased food
supply. And how the failure of the potato crop in Ireland in the late 19th
century led to mass starvation. All goes to show that humans are not immune to
the laws of nature.

WD> Also when I visited the Hermitage in St.Petersburg in 2009 there was a
WD> room full with paintings from 15-16 hundred depicting scenes in a
WD> butchershop and a fishstore.

Like in an oriental market nowadays. Must have stunk pretty badly.

WD> In the butchershop are animals of which I'm not certain I know them.
WD> In the fishstore there were mainly humongous salmon, halibut,
WD> dolphins, porpoises and seals.

Presumably artistic license. No refrigeration and bad roads, remember?
Everything would have to be locally available.

RB>> Otherwise nothing special. I even took part in a wine grape harvest
RB>> one time when I was in Heldelberg - back-breaking work, incidentally.
RB>> The interesting part was when I wanted to throw away a bunch of
RB>> grapes that had fallen on the ground and looked half rotten. The
RB>> vinyard owner stopped me and told me those were the best grapes
RB>> because the sugar content was higher than those on the vine. Same
RB>> applies to grapes with a mould on them they term "edele Faeule"
RB>> (noble decay). The mold pierces the skin of the grape, which then
RB>> shrinks due to evaporation of the water in it, and the sugar content
RB>> of the juice - although a reduced amount - is increased. This, I was
RB>> told, was a particularly desirable thing.

WD> Absolutely. In French it is called "vendange tardive" ... meaning when
WD> the sugar content is high enough certain sections of grapes are not
WD> picked until late in the year, sometimes November and even in the
WD> snow. They are left to decay somewhat. They become very fragile and
WD> are being handpicked grape by grape. The wine from those grapes is
WD> very sweet and ... very expensive.

What you're talking about is something different than what I meant.

WD> I'v encountered the same in Western Montana in vineyards. They call it
WD> "ice wine" there because of the cold circumstances when the grapes are
WD> picked.

And _that_ is also what they call it in Germany (Eiswein), but this has nothing
to do with the "edele Faeule" mold. That develops during the late summer and
early fall. The only similarity here is that a smaller amount of grape juice
with a higher sugar content than normal results, but in the case of Eiswein the
amount is so little the wine is sold as a specialty. The wine made with grapes
exhibiting "edele Faeule" is not, it's just normal wine, albeit of good
quality. The grape growers like such grapes because they are paid by the sugar
content of the juice pressed from them.

Incidentally, it's highly illegal to add sugar to grape juice for use in making
wine in Germany (presumably also in other countries), and there have been a
couple of scandals here in Germany (many years ago) where this was done and
discovered. Apparently it's even possible in most cases to detect artificial
addition of "sugar" even when the same sugar as in the grapes is added (optical
rotation of the sugar is used to test it), so if there's suspicion of
adulteration, it's usually found out and severely punished (jail).

[Duesseldorfer Altbier]
RB>> When I first came to Germany, you couldn't get it outside of the
RB>> Duesseldorf/Cologne area because (I was told) it didn't travel well.
RB>> Apparently that's meanwhile been changed, how I don't know, but
RB>> nowadays you can buy it anywhere.

WD> Cool transport?

I don't think so, since it's not refrigerated when you buy it. My guess would
be microfiltration to get rid of any solid components that could accelerate
degradation. Even so, it's not storeable for long - I believe around a month is
supposed to be the maximum.

WD> I remember something similar with Dutch mussels. They were only
WD> available in months that contained an "R" in the name. But these are
WD> the colder months. Since cold transports are possible, you can now
WD> have mussels all year around.

Yes, and isn't it lovely? ;-) I like mussels, too - just so much trouble to
prepare (huge pots required for cooking) that we rarely have them.

WD> I know about certain English beers that deteriorate real fast ... they
WD> must be consumed within 2-3 weeks of brewing or they turn bad.

That sounds like the Duesseldorfer Alt, maybe something similar.

Cheers, Bob

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