Text 293, 156 rader
Skriven 2005-05-13 12:18:26 av Carol Shenkenberger (6:757/1)
    Kommentar till text 279 av Michiel van der Vlist (2:280/5555)
Ärende: Re: Changing FTS-0001.
==============================
*** Quoting Michiel van der Vlist from a message to Carol Shenkenberger ***

MvdV>> No you don't. Now that you are ZC you have the opportunity
MvdV>> to reorganise the zone.

 > No.  Please, LISTEN to me.  You are dreaming.  I do not have
 > the resources in this smaller zone that is more IP intense
 > percentage than any other zone out there,

MvdV> Is that so? When I discard the garbage from the zone 6 segment I count
MvdV> 5 POTS and 3 IP systems in zone 6. POTS is still in the majority. That
MvdV> is assuming the information /you/ provide is correct.

Smile, I appreciate the ideas!  One factor is known and i've not been hiding
it.  Z6 segment is not accurate one POTS listings.  Hence, your data
solutions(no fault of your own) do not work.

MvdV> It is not what I desire, it is what policy says: assignment of node nu
MvdV> shpuld be based on technical reasons only. If you follow that guide li

Yes, and this has already changed in some zones, and changed in Z6 before i
even got there.

Z6 allows and has for some time, IP only nodes and NC's and *RC's*. I do not
want to arge the validity of this as it is not arguable.  Facts are facts.  Z6
has IP Only RC's.

MvdV> there is no need for ION hosts in Z6.

 > When you and some others in Z2 speak on this, they think with
 > the mindset of at least 4 of 5 nodes have a POTS line.

MvdV> Carol, you /have/ five nodes with a POTS line. And you only need one..

Umm, no, I have 3 POTS nodes.  1 of them has a ring-down setup that is not
reachable from outside his country as far as I can determine.  The rest are
lingering bad listings I have not yet fixed.

MvdV> I never said or meant to say that whatever is left of zone 6 should be
MvdV> "demised". Of course not, we should do our utmost to see that the node
MvdV> remain connected.

MvdV> And this time I am not talking about having the remaining nodes move t
MvdV> a neighbouring zone either. (Although I still say that would be the lo
MvdV> thing to do).

In the long term, if Z6 can not function, this is what will happen.  Due to
commonality of several things, they would shift to Z3 more naturally than any
other place. Next most likely would be following actual path of connection
which is Z1.

MvdV> Your job is not impossible. But you have to think out of the box to un
MvdV> the mess.

Grin, have ben thinking out of the box.  It's just not the same solution you
have.

 > vary, do so in such a way as to not cause harm.

MvdV> Your job is to find the best achievable connectivity for the nodes in
MvdV> your zone. Indeed without causing conflict with others.

Hence i really *really* want to get away from the 000- listings.  Unfortunately
I have no other option just now for some of those you see as 'POTS' but to
shift them to 000-0-0-0-0.  Li for example simply does not have a valid POTS
number nor do any sites in China as far as I can tell.

 > for a Z3 innocent sysop to attempt to direct dial as they
 > check on a sysop that lives where they might vacation.

 > What i need is an answer that unties Pvt and -Unpublished-.
 > The software is there.  It's just getting people to implement
 > it that may be the problem.

MvdV> No, that is not the problem. Think out of the box Carol. Walk around t
MvdV> problem and have a look at it from the other side. Ask yourself if wha
MvdV> you perceive to be the problem really is the problem.

Yes, that is the problem.  I've looked.  Nor can I take a person who is a valid
node and just shift their nodenumber in a weeks notice out here in the boonies
of Fidonet.  Wont work for us, nor would it work where you are if you think
about it.


 > In the meantime, with extreme unhappiness, I have to shift
 > nodes to 000-0-0-0-0 for the phone line shortly or risk yet
 > more bogus numbers.  At least that one is known and folks
 > should be aware to block it.

MvdV> Inadvertent dialling of bogus numbers that can cause problems to the c
MvdV> is just one issue and I think it is not the main one.

MvdV> The main issue is connectivity.

It is an issue out here of main concern.  I cant force the folks out here to
post in echos you travel, but I can prevent dialing problems due to bogus
phone numbers.

I jhust notified Z6 that unless I hear dissent, we swap all 'bogus phone number
sets that cant go PVT to 000-0-0-0-0 shortly.  I didnt set a date but was
thinking to give them a week or so.  I do *not* like this solution as i
dislike the 000- standard since we have an answer now to avoid it, but without
implementation, I have no other options just now to get the bad POTS numbers
out.

As I get approval to nodelist the email addresses in the nodelist, I will add
those in so connectivity is better.  I do not have approval yet for them so
can not just enter the ones i have (and I have connection with most via that).


MvdV> Decoupling "Pvt" and "-Unpublished-" will indeed allow you to list Joe
MvdV> Sysop, who's system is ION, as host. But if you go for that approach I
MvdV> The question should not be "how can I list Joe as host?". The question
MvdV> should be "how can I arrange for the best connectivity for the nodes i
MvdV> my zone?"

Smile, I can dream!  Path of connection here is nothing like you have
experience in.  It is no fault of yours that this is not like the model you
have been trained in for the past several years.  Took me a bit to catch on
too.  Just keep in mind no 2 zones are the same and a pattern that matches
your own experience as 'works well' need not be the one another zone has grown
up with that also 'works well'.  Z3 is a classic there that is radically
different from Z2 yet 'works well'.

MvdV> Forget about the existing situation. Forget about silly notions like r
MvdV> should equate countries etc. ect. That make no sense anymore in your s


Smioe again!  Z6 long went away from that. Hasnt been 1 country per region for
a very long time.  China is the only one that lists only China nodes, all the
others are mixed based on connectivity.

MvdV>> the only logical answer to that question is: One.

Nope.  2, with China abouyt to demise as I said being next in line.


MvdV> Forget about the past. Forget about silly notions like "demising" a re
MvdV> A region is nothing but an administrative thing. They were introduced
MvdV> to reduce the administrative load on the coordinators. Totally unneede
MvdV> in your situation. Forget the whole concept of Regions. Think about th

Did you track that we demised 5 regions in the past 18 months?  I am looking
close at China but not ready just yet.

MvdV> Here is one possible answer: (Just an example mind you.)

Smile, gives me a few ideas.  Not what I want to do just yet though. I DO
appreciate it however.  Humm, comes to mind you seg doesnt quite match mine
yet.  You still list Thailand for example.  I took them out I think it was 2
segments ago.  Might be a processing problem I was unaware of?

                                       xxcarol

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