Text 8025, 188 rader
Skriven 2006-11-17 02:23:06 av Maurice Kinal (1:140/13.1)
Kommentar till text 8023 av mark lewis (1:3634/12.0)
Ärende: compress.cfg
====================
Hey mark!
Nov 16 20:29 06, mark lewis wrote to Maurice Kinal:
ml> i'm still confused as to what you classify as "DOS think"...
zip would fall into the DOS-think category nicely. Anything that tries to do
everything and does any one thing poorly and isn't documented. DOS itself is
DOS-think to the extreme and just when it started to look like it couldn't get
any worse MS decided we all wanted and needed a seriously broken GUI based on
everything that exemplifies what is bad about DOS-think.
Is that any clearer?
ml> things that you classify as "DOS think" i don't find to be because
ml> i've always encountered them in other OS environments...
Me too. I say let it die already!!! Jeez.
ml> hunh? are you talking about the binary PKT and stored messages
ml> format?
I could care less about that but definetly it should have never leaked into
transfers given it has nothing to do with compatibilty of the native hardware
employed other then specific codes between the computer and the hardware
(originally serial POTs modems) which mostly were text based as far as the user
was concerned wrt configuring.
ml> overcome by the use of another PKT format that is detectable and able
ml> to be handled by mail tossers...
Okay. How many of those are still in usuage these days? Argueably none that
I've noticed, especially locally. If I wish to communicate via the computer to
local people a mailer would be a lousy choice and ensure that I am compatible
with nobody. I am not sure what you're seeing in your local area but here none
of this is compatible and one would think there would be something suitable.
ml> there are several PKT format
ml> proposals in the FTSC archives... some have example codings and
ml> handlers but unfortunately none were ever embraced by any tosser
ml> coders and thus have languished as nothing more than proposals...
Right. I've noticed that as well as proposals that were poorly implimented and
now we are stuck with the results of that since the autors have long abandoned
their work for whatever reason, good or bad.
MK>> preferred over a purely character based format
ml> like email and news? the reason is quite simple... no one coded
ml> support for it and thus the populace never had a chance to select it
ml> for use...
Yes they have chosen. That is one reason there are so few users. No?
ml> coders... i'm aware of more than one Type3 PKT format as well as a
ml> Type10 format...
Whatever. That isn't what we're stuck with though.
ml> to implement a new PKT format only takes one to code it and have it
ml> supported... in fact, it doesn't even have to be mainstream as long
ml> as you can get your feed to support it...
Both only ship zip and I ship back only raw pkt's which theh ***must***
support. Right? I chose raw pkt's but they both insist on supporting what is
a questionable practice for whatever reason.
ml> task as having their current tosser create unbundled (ie: raw) PKTs
ml> for your system and then they run a "conversion" tool on them to put
ml> them in the plaintext ascii format you desire...
I used to do that. I also was using vim as my editor of choice. However that
only solves half of the problem and thus I am forced to filter incoming via
ttylinux which has the 'unzip' function of busybox by default. Since then I
have just gone with the flow and use hpt/msged to handle raw pkt creation and
ship it out that way rather then fight against the tide towards obscurity.
ml> do such would also be quite easy to implement... it would just need
ml> to read the current Type2 PKT files and move the headers to the top
ml> while converting from binary to text the current binary data...
Or not. Easier to just not worry about it and watch the tide carry off
everything we call Fido into the vast void of nothingness.
ml> the counter argument to that is that it is faster to transmit e32
ml> than 3634... sure, that's only one character but the idea is what
ml> we're talking about... it is also easier for programs to work with
ml> hex than ascii if the data is needed to be in ascii anyway...
Sure.
ml> and before you say it, i don't see how that can be considered "DOS
ml> think" ;)
It doesn't matter what I call it ... does it?
MK>> Last time I checked DOS could handle character based formatting
MK>> quite well or as well as DOS could handle any other type of
MK>> formatting.
ml> no, you are right...
I know I am. I wrote a DOS-based BBS for myself on that exact principle (POTs
external modem). It worked great for the short time I used it. However I
moved on and it got lost in the shuffle we call progress. I don't even have a
modem anymore and don't miss them whatsoever, nevermind DOS.
MK>> Seems to me that the last decade has only promoted compatibilty
MK>> with abandonware which y2k was supposed to have completely
MK>> obliterated.
ml> hunh?? if you are speaking of stuff like QWK then what you are
ml> actually witnessing is the average population of users not being
ml> willing to give up their existing and favorite tools and methods...
Right. Probably the lot of them can be counted on two hands, maybe even one.
I am not aware of anyone locally using anything remotely like QWK offline
readers. How many there?
ml> software is still operable today... however, i think you'll see them
ml> fall by the wayside in another 31-32 years ;)
I'd say less then that but we'll see. Prove me wrong. I double dare you!!!
;-)
ml> most all of them left fidonet for various reasons...
Right. When the cat is away ...
ml> "failure"... EMSI, on the other hand, was accepted and is actively
ml> used today...
None around here (locally) and if there are they aren't identifiable and thus
not condusive to growth amongst Fido as a whole. Exactly who are we doing all
this for?
ml> have you seen the BBS Documentary, yet?
Nope. I saw it all happen. Did they mention anything about VAX/VMS?
:::snicker:::
The first BBS I ever saw was hosted on a VAX/VMS system and had nothing to do
with Fido. It was years later before I saw a public BBS on a phoneline. It
was very simular except totally different as to usage.
ml> it is available from the
ml> author for $30 or $40 but it has also been released so that it is
ml> free to share... i grabbed a copy of a DVD rip and have watched it a
ml> time or two... it is really an eyeopener in some cases... i wasn't as
ml> surprised at some of tom jennings statements as i'm sure others
ml> possibly were ;)
That part might be interesting. I never did talk to him or everr see any
messages from that direction in all my experience with Fido. I have heard
other's claims about him.
ml> joho,
Him I am aware of. He did some really good stuff in his Fido time.
ml> of GEcho,
Seen it but never used it myself. Same with much of the Fido related stuff. I
was more interested in the basic functionality of modems back then and wasn't
what you call a regular sysop by any stretch of the imagination. I was a user
on more then just a few 'regular' BBS's though but never thought at the time I
wanted or needed to replicate any of it myself. I miss those days.
ml> and numerous others... the PCBoard guys were represented as
ml> well as the original Mustang Software (WildCAT!) guys...
Right. I remember running across a few of those. Maximus was the usual though
or at least later on.
ml> terminal applications like ProComm and Telix...
Telix was a well used one. I had my own as I required one to work with a Unix
based server at the time and there wasn't anything suitable for that then. I
also recall the first time I used Lynx to connect to an networked library
database. Man was that ever a painful experience and now I find myself using
it all the time except locally instead of networked. Times sure change despite
remaining exactly the same.
Life is good,
Maurice
--- Msged/LNX 6.2.0
* Origin: The Pointy Stick Society XXV - Almost there (1:140/13.1)
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