Text 2111, 437 rader
Skriven 2005-01-21 15:42:00 av Rich (1:379/45)
Kommentar till text 2110 av Geo (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Do we protect users from their own stupidity?
=========================================================
From: "Rich" <@>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_00E9_01C4FFCF.C020E170
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The headers are included with all the other headers. The PDF =
attachment is included among the attachments.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message news:41f19043@w3.nls.net...
Yes Outlook does hide information that you can see in the raw email. =
Suppose you send a text message with a pdf attachment and you receive it = in
outlook
Ok show me how to see this part
------=3D_013325721613207
Content-Type: application/octet-stream;
name=3D"RS129067.PDF"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64
Content-Disposition: attachment;
filename=3D"RS129067.PDF"
That's the chunk of the raw message I want to see. You open the =
message and it's text with an attachment, right clicking on the body = gives no
"view source" choice. Where can I view the raw base64 text that = was sent as
part of an email? Outlook converted it to an attachment but = there is no way
to see the raw information as it was when it passed thru = the spam filters.
From outlook can you even tell if it was BASE64 or some other encoding =
method that was used?
you can't see this boundry info for the text part either.
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41f13425@w3.nls.net...
You keep claiming the information is hiden. It's not. It's just =
not in your face. It shouldn't be. The examples you give are rare. =
Virtually all the time you have no desire for the routing encoding = garbage
that means nothing to virtually everyone.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41f0e6b7$1@w3.nls.net...
Say you have a customer who is having some problem getting emails =
from an email list or they keep getting the same email over and over = again or
they got an email hours after it was sent and want to know why = or any of a
dozen other reasons where you need to see information that = most email
programs now hide.
interesting idea of saving the message, changing the extension =
then attaching it to a new email, I may try that one although that still = may
be a bit much to explain to some people.
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net...
What kind of email issue? The encoded body parts only matter =
to me when I suspect there is a problem with the encoding in the sending = app.
OE forward is fine. Use Forward As Attachment. Outlook will =
do this but you have to select two or more messages, forward, then = delete the
extra. There may be a simpler way but I know this one works. =
Still you still won't get what you want from any email program because =
the RFCs have specific rules regarding an embedded RFC822 encoded = message
that may mandate re-encoding parts of it. If I'm really = concerned I have
people save the message, rename it with some = non-message extension, then
attach the renamed file.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net...
Yes, pretty much any time you have an email issue you need to =
solve, you have to be able to look at the raw message in it's entirety = or be
able to cut/paste it into another email so you can forward it to = someone so
they can see it in it's original form.
The way outlook and outlook express "forward" feature works it =
is virtually useless to forward an email to tech support because all the =
important parts are either removed or modified. ISP techs and = postmasters
walk people thru this copying the raw email to a new email = procedure all the
time.
As an end user you probably wouldn't need it except if you =
were a geek but for support purposes it's quite common.
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net...
Outlook is not limited to RFC822 format nor is this the =
native format. What you describe is RFC822 specific and assumes that = the
RFC822 format is the storage format.
Do you really view the headers and the encoded body parts =
as something you view for the same reasons?
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net...
I like the outlook express view source feature better than =
that. It allows me to see the headers and the source of the message all = in
one window and I can get to that window without ever opening the = email.
Really wish I could do that in Outlook. (I'm running Outlook 2000 = but it
doesn't sound like the current version is much improved wrt this = feature)
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message =
news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net...
The headers, all headers for both the message and all =
the MIME parts.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net...
does that show you just the headers or is it like OE =
view source where it shows the whole raw email all in one screen?
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message =
news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net...
Full headers, yes. In the options dialog.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41eda613@w3.nls.net...
In the current version of Outlook, is there a way =
to view the source for an email without opening the email first like you = can
do in Outlook express?=20
Geo.
------=_NextPart_000_00E9_01C4FFCF.C020E170
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.1289" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> The headers are included =
with all the=20
other headers. The PDF attachment is included among the=20
attachments.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote=20
in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41f19043@w3.nls.net">news:41f19043@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Yes Outlook does hide =
information that you=20
can see in the raw email. Suppose you send a text message with a pdf=20
attachment and you receive it in outlook</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Ok show me how to see this =
part</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>------=3D_013325721613207<BR>Content-Type:=20
=
application/octet-stream;<BR>name=3D"RS129067.PDF"<BR>Content-Transfer-En=
coding:=20
BASE64<BR>Content-Disposition:=20
attachment;<BR>filename=3D"RS129067.PDF"<BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That's the chunk of the raw message I =
want to=20
see. You open the message and it's text with an attachment, right =
clicking on=20
the body gives no "view source" choice. Where can I view the raw =
base64 text=20
that was sent as part of an email? Outlook converted it to an =
attachment but=20
there is no way to see the raw information as it was when it passed =
thru the=20
spam filters.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>From outlook can you even tell if it =
was BASE64=20
or some other encoding method that was used?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>you can't see this boundry info for =
the text part=20
either.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41f13425@w3.nls.net">news:41f13425@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> You keep claiming the =
information=20
is hiden. It's not. It's just not in your face. It =
shouldn't be. The examples you give are rare. Virtually =
all the=20
time you have no desire for the routing encoding garbage that means =
nothing=20
to virtually everyone.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>>=20
wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41f0e6b7$1@w3.nls.net">news:41f0e6b7$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Say you have a customer who is =
having some=20
problem getting emails from an email list or they keep getting the =
same=20
email over and over again or they got an email hours after it was =
sent and=20
want to know why or any of a dozen other reasons where you need to =
see=20
information that most email programs now hide.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>interesting idea of saving the =
message,=20
changing the extension then attaching it to a new email, I may try =
that=20
one although that still may be a bit much to explain to some=20
people.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net">news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> What kind of email =
issue? The encoded body parts only matter to me when I =
suspect=20
there is a problem with the encoding in the sending =
app.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> OE forward is =
fine. Use=20
Forward As Attachment. Outlook will do this but you have =
to select=20
two or more messages, forward, then delete the extra. =
There may be=20
a simpler way but I know this one works. Still you still =
won't get=20
what you want from any email program because the RFCs have =
specific=20
rules regarding an embedded RFC822 encoded message that may =
mandate=20
re-encoding parts of it. If I'm really concerned I have =
people=20
save the message, rename it with some non-message extension, =
then attach=20
the renamed file.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote =
in message=20
<A=20
=
href=3D"news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net">news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Yes, pretty much any time you =
have an=20
email issue you need to solve, you have to be able to look at =
the raw=20
message in it's entirety or be able to cut/paste it into =
another email=20
so you can forward it to someone so they can see it in it's =
original=20
form.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The way outlook and outlook =
express=20
"forward" feature works it is virtually useless to forward an =
email to=20
tech support because all the important parts are either =
removed or=20
modified. ISP techs and postmasters walk people thru this =
copying the=20
raw email to a new email procedure all the time.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>As an end user you probably =
wouldn't need=20
it except if you were a geek but for support purposes it's =
quite=20
common.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> Outlook is not =
limited to=20
RFC822 format nor is this the native format. What you =
describe=20
is RFC822 specific and assumes that the RFC822 format is the =
storage=20
format.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> Do you really =
view the=20
headers and the encoded body parts as something you view for =
the=20
same reasons?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> =
wrote in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I like the outlook =
express view=20
source feature better than that. It allows me to see the =
headers=20
and the source of the message all in one window and I can =
get to=20
that window without ever opening the email. Really wish I =
could do=20
that in Outlook. (I'm running Outlook 2000 but it doesn't =
sound=20
like the current version is much improved wrt this=20
feature)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> The =
headers, all=20
headers for both the message and all the MIME=20
parts.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net">news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>does that show you =
just the=20
headers or is it like OE view source where it shows =
the whole=20
raw email all in one screen?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net">news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> Full =
headers,=20
yes. In the options dialog.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>>=20
wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41eda613@w3.nls.net">news:41eda613@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>In the current =
version of=20
Outlook, is there a way to view the source for an =
email=20
without opening the email first like you can do in =
Outlook=20
express? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
=
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BL=
OCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE=
></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_00E9_01C4FFCF.C020E170--
--- BBBS/NT v4.01 Flag-5
* Origin: Barktopia BBS Site http://HarborWebs.com:8081 (1:379/45)
|