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Text 6148, 413 rader
Skriven 2005-07-19 09:01:58 av Geo (1:379/45)
   Kommentar till text 6146 av Rich (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Disk perf
=====================
From: "Geo" <georger@nls.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C58C40.84B35CF0
Content-Type: text/plain;
        charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

That would be dependent upon your settings, if it's checking to see if =
anything changed then it has to have info on all the things that might = have
changed including ad graphics and such.

You do have your cache settings so that it checks each time you go to a = site,
don't you?

Geo.
  "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:42dc3768@w3.nls.net...
     I don't believe you know how the cache works.

  Rich

    "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message news:42dc211c@w3.nls.net...
      1     9 ms    11 ms     9 ms  [216.144.26.33]
      2    45 ms    86 ms    55 ms  r-cle2.nls.net [216.144.8.2]
      3    46 ms    65 ms    44 ms  r-cle1.nls.net [216.144.8.1]
      4    59 ms    55 ms    53 ms  sl-gw4-roa-4-0-ts2.sprintlink.net =
[144.228.252.233]
      5    72 ms    53 ms    65 ms  sl-bb22-roa-2-1.sprintlink.net =
[144.232.17.205]
      6    76 ms    73 ms    56 ms  sl-bb22-chi-6-1.sprintlink.net =
[144.232.8.81]
      7    60 ms    59 ms    58 ms  sl-st21-chi-11-0.sprintlink.net =
[144.232.20.21]
      8    58 ms    53 ms    91 ms  sl-xocomm-15-0.sprintlink.net =
[144.223.241.66]
      9    56 ms   105 ms    56 ms  p5-0-0.rar2.chicago-il.us.xo.net =
[65.106.6.137]
     10    58 ms    61 ms    94 ms  p0-0-0d0.rar1.chicago-il.us.xo.net =
[65.106.1.85]
     11    79 ms   114 ms    85 ms  p6-0-0.rar2.washington-dc.us.xo.net =
[65.106.0.46]
     12    85 ms    91 ms    82 ms  =
p0-0-0d0.rar1.washington-dc.us.xo.net [65.106.1.13]
     13    78 ms    75 ms   161 ms  p6-0-0.rar2.nyc-ny.us.xo.net =
[65.106.0.1]
     14    76 ms    81 ms   286 ms  p0-0-0d0.rar1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net =
[65.106.1.1]
     15   114 ms    76 ms    79 ms  p0-0-0.mar1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net =
[65.106.3.46]
     16    76 ms    99 ms    78 ms  p0-0.chr1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net =
[207.88.86.166]

    You probably have about 100ms more lag cause of the distance. Cache =
will still be slow if you have lag because it's still got to resolve and =
check the linked graphics and such before it can match them up with the =
cache.

    Geo.


      "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:42db0176@w3.nls.net...
         It can't get any faster than the network traffic.  I'm at least =
15 hops from the nyt.  If their servers are on the east cost you will be = much
closer.  Since all the downloads are small latency matters more = than
throughput which is why with everything cached it still took six = seconds for
me.

      Rich

        "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:42dafff1@w3.nls.net...
        I just clicked and counted, 1...2...3..finished

        I'm serious though, set your cache to 1mb, purge it, go to that =
/content.ie5 directory and purge it as well then give it a try.

        Geo.
          "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:42dafba4@w3.nls.net...
             You can't compare two machines connected to different =
networks at different times of the day.

             Did you measure the 4 seconds by counting or measuring?  I =
used a network capture with timestamps for all the packets.  The time I =
reported is from the first request to the last request.  I should have =
included the last response so my numbers, which I rounded down to whole =
seconds, would actually be a bit longer.

          Rich

            "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:42dae95a$1@w3.nls.net...
            I clicked on your NYT link and my browser started up and the =
page came up in less than 4 seconds total. Perhaps instead of an empty = cache
you should try it with your cache set to 1mb.

            Geo.
              "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:42d9397d@w3.nls.net...
                 Because the cache still has a very significant =
performance benefit and even with DSL speeds pages take far longer than = a
blink to appear.  For example, I just tried www.nytimes.com with an = empty
cache.  There are 86 HTTP requests that take 10 seconds.  With the = cache it
only took 6 seconds.

                 Your ideas on DNS are equally silly, particularly =
because DNS is explicitly a multi-level cache.

              Rich

                "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:42d9304a$1@w3.nls.net...
                "Frank Haber" <frhaber@N0SPMrcn.com> wrote in message
                news:42d84be9$1@w3.nls.net...
                > (Browser cache)
                >
                > Firefox and Moz come set to 50MB.  I find that a good =
round number.

                When I was on dialup, 5mb seemed like a good cache (50 =
munutes to download
                5mb), because cache made a difference. On todays DSL =
connected computers,
                nothing but the previous 4 or so pages should be cached, =
it's just a huge
                waste since it only takes a blink to bring up a page on =
DSL. Why todays
                browsers continue this outdated practice and don't sense =
the connection
                speed and adjust accordingly is beyond me.

                It's the same logic as the DNS client cache, both these =
caching functions
                create limited problems from time to time, the goal =
should be to get away
                from problematic methods and go for reliability. Of =
course that's a concept
                that's foreign to most programmers today, they are blind =
to the idea of
                dropping an obsolete function and would rather waste =
time trying to cure the
                problems it creates.

                Geo.


------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C58C40.84B35CF0
Content-Type: text/html;
        charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1505" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That would be dependent upon your =
settings, if it's=20
checking to see if anything changed then it has to have info on all the =
things=20
that might have changed including ad graphics and such.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>You do have your cache settings so that =
it checks=20
each time you go to a site, don't you?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:42dc3768@w3.nls.net">news:42dc3768@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't believe you know =
how the=20
  cache works.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
  style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt;=20
    wrote in message <A=20
    =
href=3D"news:42dc211c@w3.nls.net">news:42dc211c@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 9=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 11 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 9 ms&nbsp;=20
    [216.144.26.33]<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 45 =
ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 86=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 55 ms&nbsp; r-cle2.nls.net =
[216.144.8.2]<BR>&nbsp;=20
    3&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 46 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 65 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
44=20
    ms&nbsp; r-cle1.nls.net [216.144.8.1]<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
59=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 55 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 53 ms&nbsp;=20
    sl-gw4-roa-4-0-ts2.sprintlink.net [144.228.252.233]<BR>&nbsp;=20
    5&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 72 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 53 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
65=20
    ms&nbsp; sl-bb22-roa-2-1.sprintlink.net =
[144.232.17.205]</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 76=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 73 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 56 ms&nbsp;=20
    sl-bb22-chi-6-1.sprintlink.net [144.232.8.81]<BR>&nbsp; =
7&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
    60 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 59 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 58 ms&nbsp;=20
    sl-st21-chi-11-0.sprintlink.net [144.232.20.21]</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 58=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 53 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 91 ms&nbsp;=20
    sl-xocomm-15-0.sprintlink.net [144.223.241.66]<BR>&nbsp; =
9&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
    56 ms&nbsp;&nbsp; 105 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 56 ms&nbsp;=20
    p5-0-0.rar2.chicago-il.us.xo.net [65.106.6.137]</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;10&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 58=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 61 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 94 ms&nbsp;=20
    p0-0-0d0.rar1.chicago-il.us.xo.net [65.106.1.85]</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;11&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 79 =
ms&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
    114 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 85 ms&nbsp; =
p6-0-0.rar2.washington-dc.us.xo.net=20
    [65.106.0.46]<BR>&nbsp;12&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 85 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
91=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 82 ms&nbsp; =
p0-0-0d0.rar1.washington-dc.us.xo.net=20
    [65.106.1.13]<BR>&nbsp;13&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 78 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
75=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp; 161 ms&nbsp; p6-0-0.rar2.nyc-ny.us.xo.net=20
    [65.106.0.1]<BR>&nbsp;14&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 76 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
81=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp; 286 ms&nbsp; p0-0-0d0.rar1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net=20
    [65.106.1.1]<BR>&nbsp;15&nbsp;&nbsp; 114 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 76=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 79 ms&nbsp; p0-0-0.mar1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net=20
    [65.106.3.46]<BR>&nbsp;16&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 76 ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
99=20
    ms&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 78 ms&nbsp; p0-0.chr1.nyc-ny.us.xo.net=20
    [207.88.86.166]</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>You probably have about 100ms more =
lag cause of=20
    the distance. Cache will still be slow if you have lag because it's =
still=20
    got to resolve and check&nbsp;the linked graphics and such before it =
can=20
    match them up with the cache.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
    style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
      <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
      =
href=3D"news:42db0176@w3.nls.net">news:42db0176@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; It can't get any =
faster than the=20
      network traffic.&nbsp; I'm at least 15 hops from the nyt.&nbsp; If =
their=20
      servers are on the east cost you will be much closer.&nbsp; Since =
all the=20
      downloads are small latency matters more than throughput which is =
why with=20
      everything cached it still took six seconds for me.</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
      style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
        <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt;=20
        wrote in message <A=20
        =
href=3D"news:42dafff1@w3.nls.net">news:42dafff1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I just clicked and counted,=20
        1...2...3..finished</FONT></DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm serious though, set your =
cache to 1mb,=20
        purge it, go to that /content.ie5 directory and purge it as well =
then=20
        give it a try.</FONT></DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
        <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
        style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
          <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
          =
href=3D"news:42dafba4@w3.nls.net">news:42dafba4@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; You can't =
compare two=20
          machines connected to different networks at different times of =
the=20
          day.</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Did you measure =
the 4=20
          seconds by counting or measuring?&nbsp; I used a network =
capture with=20
          timestamps for all the packets.&nbsp; The time I reported is =
from the=20
          first request to the last request.&nbsp; I should have =
included the=20
          last response so my numbers, which I rounded down to whole =
seconds,=20
          would actually be a bit longer.</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
          <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
          style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
            <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A=20
            href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
            message <A=20
            =
href=3D"news:42dae95a$1@w3.nls.net">news:42dae95a$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I clicked on your NYT link =
and my=20
            browser started up and the page came up in less than 4 =
seconds=20
            total. Perhaps instead of an empty cache you should try it =
with your=20
            cache set to 1mb.</FONT></DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
            <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
            style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
              <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
              =
href=3D"news:42d9397d@w3.nls.net">news:42d9397d@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Because the =
cache still=20
              has a very significant performance benefit and even with =
DSL=20
              speeds pages take far longer than a blink to appear.&nbsp; =
For=20
              example, I just tried <A=20
              href=3D"http://www.nytimes.com">www.nytimes.com</A> with =
an empty=20
              cache.&nbsp; There are 86 HTTP requests that take 10=20
              seconds.&nbsp; With the cache it only took 6 =
seconds.</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Your ideas =
on DNS are=20
              equally silly, particularly because DNS is explicitly a=20
              multi-level cache.</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
              <BLOCKQUOTE=20
              style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
                <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A=20
                href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
                message <A=20
                =
href=3D"news:42d9304a$1@w3.nls.net">news:42d9304a$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>"Frank=20
                Haber" &lt;<A=20
                =
href=3D"mailto:frhaber@N0SPMrcn.com">frhaber@N0SPMrcn.com</A>&gt;=20
                wrote in message<BR><A=20
                =
href=3D"news:42d84be9$1@w3.nls.net">news:42d84be9$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
&gt;=20
                (Browser cache)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Firefox and Moz come set =
to=20
                50MB.&nbsp; I find that a good round number.<BR><BR>When =
I was=20
                on dialup, 5mb seemed like a good cache (50 munutes to=20
                download<BR>5mb), because cache made a difference. On =
todays DSL=20
                connected computers,<BR>nothing but the previous 4 or so =
pages=20
                should be cached, it's just a huge<BR>waste since it =
only takes=20
                a blink to bring up a page on DSL. Why =
todays<BR>browsers=20
                continue this outdated practice and don't sense the=20
                connection<BR>speed and adjust accordingly is beyond=20
                me.<BR><BR>It's the same logic as the DNS client cache, =
both=20
                these caching functions<BR>create limited problems from =
time to=20
                time, the goal should be to get away<BR>from problematic =
methods=20
                and go for reliability. Of course that's a =
concept<BR>that's=20
                foreign to most programmers today, they are blind to the =
idea=20
                of<BR>dropping an obsolete function and would rather =
waste time=20
                trying to cure the<BR>problems it=20
              =
creates.<BR><BR>Geo.<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOC=
KQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>=


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