| Text 6850, 408 rader
Skriven 2005-08-29 22:31:26 av Geo (1:379/45)
   Kommentar till text 6828 av Rich (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: TPM
===============
From: "Geo" <georger@nls.net>
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Why do you believe dislike of DRM is related to illegal copying? Can't I = hate
it just because it makes my job harder than need be?
Geo.
  "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:43126fbd@w3.nls.net...
     Brilliant.  Intel is building DRM into the pentium by adding what, =
DRM!  Wow!  Can you be any more vague or any more paranoid?
     For someone who believes his manufactured claims are irrelevant, =
you sure spend a lot of energy going on about how everyone is out to get = you
and you are entitled to steal whatever you want.
  Rich
    "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message news:43122ded@w3.nls.net...
    Only in response to your use of the term TPM, you won't find me =
using "TPM" in any of my previous posts concerning DRM which is what you = were
commenting about with your "Neither is what george likes to call = DRM."
statement.
    "It" referrs to DRM. In the case of the CPU that's probably a =
function that requires that any cards or devices you connect to the = computer
comply with the CCI and AKE requirements before being allowed = access to any
protected content. I don't really know what they have = tucked into the CPU, I
just know they are doing the "no unannounced drm" = dance instead of stating
clearly that it doesn't contain ANY NEW drm = that wasn't in previous Pentiums.
    Personally I think the whole thing is stupid, DRM isn't going to =
stop the media underground, it's going to accelerate it, all DRM is = going to
do is prove useful to create more restrictive licensing terms = for software,
something that is really going to get under my skin and = quite honestly is
going to result in MS losing it's position as king of = the hill. I really
don't want to see that happen, I like MS products.
    Geo.
      "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:43120917@w3.nls.net...
         You wrote
        Initially the idea that the TCPA had was to add a TPM chip, =
since then they
        have decided to integrate it directly into the CPU. Pentium D is =
the first
        of these CPUs.
      What do you mean by "it"?  If you don't mean the TPM then what =
exactly is "it" that is being integrated into the Pentium D?  Honestly, = I
think you have no clue and you are repeating garbage others have told = you.
      Rich
        "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:4311ff56@w3.nls.net...
        I didn't say TPM's are built into the Pentium D as I NEVER EVEN =
USE THE TERM "TPM", I said it contains DRM. Stop being such an ass.
        Geo.
          "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:4311f9f3@w3.nls.net...
             Your bogus claims regarding DRM were in regard to TPMs.  =
You are wrong that TPMs are built in to the Pentium D.  Again, your = spreading
misinformation makes you look like an idiot.  You should read = up only this
from from honest credible sources.
          Rich
            "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:4311e782@w3.nls.net...
            I'm only trying to comment on what you are claiming about ME =
with your "what George likes to call DRM" comment. If anyone here is = guilty
of spreading misinformation, it's you, I'm correcting that = misinformation..
            Geo.
              "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:4311df6d$1@w3.nls.net...
                 I'm neither talking up or talking down TPMs.  Your =
spreading misinformation or making claims based on misinformation isn't = going
to help you make a point.  It just makes you look like an idiot.
              Rich
                "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:4311ddfb@w3.nls.net...
                You are the one talking up TPM, i'm talking about your =
comment  quoted for your convenience below, on my view of DRM which is = what
I'm saying the CPU now contains. I could care less to get limited = in scope to
only TPM as that could be something as simple as encryption = or a watermark.
                Geo.
                  "Rich" <@> wrote in message =
news:4311d082$1@w3.nls.net...
                     The TPM is not in the CPU.  You need honest and =
accurate sources of info.  Neither link you give is.
                  Rich
                    "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:4311b913@w3.nls.net...
                    "Robert Comer" <bobcomer@mindspring.com> wrote in =
message
                    news:4310dbd2@w3.nls.net...
                    >        VT is virtualization.  LT is security.  =
Neither is what george
                    likes
                    > to
                    >     call DRM.
                    Initially the idea that the TCPA had was to add a =
TPM chip, since then they
                    have decided to integrate it directly into the CPU. =
Pentium D is the first
                    of these CPUs.
                    Here's the problem:
                    http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html
                    and
                    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/can-you-trust.html
                    Rich can spin it any way he likes but anyone who =
reads either of those
                    articles above will have a pretty clear =
understanding of my issues with it.
                    Geo.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Why do you believe dislike of DRM is =
related to=20
illegal copying? Can't I hate it just because it makes my job harder = than
need=20
be?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:43126fbd@w3.nls.net">news:43126fbd@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   Brilliant.  Intel =
is building=20
  DRM into the pentium by adding what, DRM!  Wow!  Can you be =
any more=20
  vague or any more paranoid?</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   For someone who believes =
his=20
  manufactured claims are irrelevant, you sure spend a lot of energy =
going on=20
  about how everyone is out to get you and you are entitled to steal =
whatever=20
  you want.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV> </DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
  style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>>=20
    wrote in message <A=20
    =
href=3D"news:43122ded@w3.nls.net">news:43122ded@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Only in response to your use of the =
term TPM,=20
    you won't find me using "TPM" in any of my previous posts concerning =
DRM=20
    which is what you were commenting about with your "<FONT =
size=3D3>Neither is=20
    what george likes to call DRM." =
statement.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT =
size=3D3></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>"It" referrs to DRM. =
In the case=20
    of the CPU that's probably a function that requires that any cards =
or=20
    devices you connect to the computer comply with the CCI and AKE =
requirements=20
    before being allowed access to any protected content. I don't really =
know=20
    what they have tucked into the CPU, I just know they are doing the =
"no=20
    unannounced drm" dance instead of stating clearly that it doesn't =
contain=20
    ANY NEW drm that wasn't in previous Pentiums.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial>Personally I think the whole thing is =
stupid, DRM=20
    isn't going to stop the media underground, it's going to accelerate =
it, all=20
    DRM is going to do is prove useful to create more restrictive =
licensing=20
    terms for software, something that is really going to get under my =
skin and=20
    quite honestly is going to result in MS losing it's position as king =
of the=20
    hill. I really don't want to see that happen, I like MS=20
    products.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><BR></DIV></FONT>
    <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
    style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
      <DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
      =
href=3D"news:43120917@w3.nls.net">news:43120917@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   You =
wrote</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
      <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
        <DIV><FONT color=3D#008000>Initially the idea that the TCPA had =
was to add=20
        a TPM chip, since then they<BR>have decided to integrate it =
directly=20
        into the CPU. Pentium D is the first<BR>of these=20
      CPUs.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>What do you mean by "it"?  =
If you don't=20
      mean the TPM then what exactly is "it" that is being integrated =
into the=20
      Pentium D?  Honestly, I think you have no clue and you are =
repeating=20
      garbage others have told you.</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
      <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
      style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
        <DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>>=20
        wrote in message <A=20
        =
href=3D"news:4311ff56@w3.nls.net">news:4311ff56@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I didn't say TPM's are built =
into the=20
        Pentium D as I NEVER EVEN USE THE TERM "TPM", I said it contains =
DRM.=20
        Stop being such an ass.</FONT></DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
        <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
        style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
          <DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
          =
href=3D"news:4311f9f3@w3.nls.net">news:4311f9f3@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   Your bogus =
claims regarding=20
          DRM were in regard to TPMs.  You are wrong that TPMs are =
built in=20
          to the Pentium D.  Again, your =
spreading misinformation=20
          makes you look like an idiot.  You should read up only =
this from=20
          from honest credible sources.</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
          <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
          style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
            <DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
            href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> =
wrote in=20
            message <A=20
            =
href=3D"news:4311e782@w3.nls.net">news:4311e782@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm only trying to comment =
on what you=20
            are claiming about ME with your "what George likes to call =
DRM"=20
            comment. If anyone here is guilty of spreading =
misinformation, it's=20
            you, I'm correcting that misinformation..</FONT></DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
            <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
            style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
              <DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
              =
href=3D"news:4311df6d$1@w3.nls.net">news:4311df6d$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   I'm neither =
talking up=20
              or talking down TPMs.  Your spreading misinformation =
or=20
              making claims based on misinformation isn't going to help =
you make=20
              a point.  It just makes you look like an =
idiot.</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV> </DIV>
              <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
              style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
                <DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
                href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> =
wrote in=20
                message <A=20
                =
href=3D"news:4311ddfb@w3.nls.net">news:4311ddfb@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>You are the one talking =
up TPM, i'm=20
                talking about your comment  quoted for your =
convenience=20
                below, on my view of DRM which is what I'm saying the =
CPU now=20
                contains. I could care less to get limited in scope to =
only TPM=20
                as that could be something as simple as encryption or a=20
                watermark.</FONT></DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
                <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
                style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
                  <DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
                  =
href=3D"news:4311d082$1@w3.nls.net">news:4311d082$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
                  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   The TPM =
is not in=20
                  the CPU.  You need honest and accurate sources of =
                  info.  Neither link you give is.</FONT></DIV>
                  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
                  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
                  <DIV> </DIV>
                  <BLOCKQUOTE=20
                  style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
                    <DIV>"Geo" <<A=20
                    =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote=20
                    in message <A=20
                    =
href=3D"news:4311b913@w3.nls.net">news:4311b913@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>"R=
obert=20
                    Comer" <<A=20
                    =
href=3D"mailto:bobcomer@mindspring.com">bobcomer@mindspring.com</A>>=20
                    wrote in message<BR><A=20
                    =
href=3D"news:4310dbd2@w3.nls.net">news:4310dbd2@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR><BR>=
>       =20
                    VT is virtualization.  LT is security.  =
Neither is=20
                    what george<BR>likes<BR>>=20
                    to<BR>>     call=20
                    DRM.<BR><BR>Initially the idea that the TCPA had was =
to add=20
                    a TPM chip, since then they<BR>have decided to =
integrate it=20
                    directly into the CPU. Pentium D is the first<BR>of =
these=20
                    CPUs.<BR><BR>Here's the problem:<BR><BR><A=20
                    =
href=3D"http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html">http://www.cl.c=
am.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html</A><BR><BR>and<BR><BR><A=20
                    =
href=3D"http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/can-you-trust.html">http://www.gnu.=
org/philosophy/can-you-trust.html</A><BR><BR>Rich=20
                    can spin it any way he likes but anyone who reads =
either of=20
                    those<BR>articles above will have a pretty clear=20
                    understanding of my issues with=20
                  =
it.<BR><BR>Geo.<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOT=
E></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOC=
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