Text 13562, 106 rader
Skriven 2005-06-13 07:19:46 av John Hull (1:379/1.99)
  Kommentar till text 13543 av Gary Braswell (1:123/789.0)
Ärende: Hatred
==============
12 Jun 05 20:09, Gary Braswell wrote to John Hull:

 John Hull ->> Gary Braswell wrote:

 JH>> 08 Jun 05 22:59, Gary Braswell wrote to John Hull:


 JH>>>>>> He didn't give a rat's butt about anything but Uncle Ho and
 JH>>>>>> controlling Vietnam, and would've allied himself with anybody
 JH>>>>>> who helped him achieve that end.

 GB>>>>> Ho liked America, traveled and learned here, hero worshipped
 GB>>>>> Claire Chenault who tried to convince the powers that were to
 GB>>>>> side with Ho. Ho even read from Jefferson when he came to 
 GB>>>>> power.

 GB>>>>> I have read a great deal about him and this is no socialist
 GB>>>>> malarky.

 GB>>>>> Ho thought the US was about supporting freedom in the world.

 GB>>>>> Unfortunately for him, the Cold War got rolling.

 GB>>>>> He joined up with the wrong crowd without a doubt. He bears 
 GB>>>>> full responsibility for that.

 GB>>>>> But what is the old saying? Thine enemy is my ally.

 GB>>>>> Heck we crawled into bed with Saddam when he was beating up on
 GB>>>>> Iran. We gave him the strains he used to develop bio weapons, 
 GB>>>>> we even looked the other way when he used it.

 GB>>>>> We have supported dictators, bloody butchers around the world 
 GB>>>>> and looked the other way when they death squaded their own 
 GB>>>>> people.

 GB>>>>> We crawled into bed with some pretty nasty people. We were
 GB>>>>> fighting for our existence as a nation.

 GB>>>>> Vietnam had been fighting for how long to get the foreigners 
 GB>>>>> out?

 JH>>>> I've read a lot about Ho too, and he ain't the kindly oriental
 JH>>>> grandfather you make him out to be.  My point still stands that 
 JH>>>> if he REALLY understood the things that Washington and Jefferson 
 JH>>>> stood for, he wouldn't have gone courting Stalin and Mao.

 GB>>> Where have I made him into a kindly grandfather? That is 
 GB>>> hyperbole from the 60s.

 JH>> Nice herring there, Gary.  Did you catch it yourself?

 JH>> Yeah, that's the cliche from the 60's left wing types.  But, it 
 JH>> didn't get to be a cliche without a core of truth planting the 
 JH>> seed.  And you still didn't address my point.  If he was so 
 JH>> enamored of the US and our Founding Fathers, he wouldn't have 
 JH>> turned to the damn COMMUNISTS to get

 GB> He turned to us first, we turned him down. He went to the 
 GB> communists. I don't agree with that and after that point, he and 
 GB> his people became what they thought they fought against. He and 
 GB> his people became evil. End justifies the means and all that, 
 GB> right?

He turned to us first because we were in control of Indochina, just having
kicked the Japs out.  He tried to sweet-talk us into going against the French,
who he figured wasn't in any position to come back and reestablish power.  But,
he didn't figure on Truman putting the inclusion of France in NATO ahead of all
other concerns.  Truman didn't care about Indochina.  In fact, we were paying
the logistics bill for France anyway because they were broke.  But it made
DeGaulle happy, and that's all that counted.

 JH>> what he wanted.  What that tells you is that he didn't give a damn 
 JH>> HOW, as long as he was ABLE TO.  That's a fact of history that you 
 JH>> can't twist or rationalize or make into an exercise in moderation.

 GB> I don't twist history John.

You just read it funny sometimes.

 GB> We backed Saddam, knowing full well his murderous tendencies and 
 GB> looked the other way when he unleashed WMD's on his own people. We 
 GB> backed a lot of murderous despots, paid them, trained them and got 
 GB> involved in some cases with their schemes. We looked the other way 
 GB> while they butchered their own.

We didn't "back Saddam."  We played Iraq against Iran to keep Iran from gaining
too much regional power, and only provided intel - nothing else.  It wouldn't
have made a tinker's damn worth of difference WHO was in power in Iraq.

 GB> We did it during the Cold War where we were fighting for our 
 GB> survival short of launching nukes.

 GB> People do a lot of things in times of war that are bad ideas.

What was bad about it?  Iraq and Iran, and a dozen other countries were chess
pieces in a deadly serious game with the Soviets.  We kept them at bay until
Reagan brought them down.  I'd say we did a pretty good job.

John 

America:  First, Last, and Always!
LIBERALS AND DOGS KEEP OFF THE GRASS!

--- Msged/386 TE 05
 * Origin: We are the Watchmen of our own Liberty! (1:379/1.99)