Text 22620, 529 rader
Skriven 2006-09-23 00:30:58 av Bob Sakowski (1:275/311)
     Kommentar till en text av John Hull
Ärende: Re: Next Sunday
=======================
John Hull wrote:

> Last Sunday at the end of the FoxNews Sunday show, Chris Wallace
> announced that Bill Clinton would be the guest in an exclusive
> interview the following week.

Here's the full, unedited transcript John.  I wonder how much will
get into the show come Sunday...  Likely not much.

[begin]
Fox News Sunday, Interview With President Bill Clinton, 9/22/06
(Rough Transcript)

WALLACE: In a recent issue of the New Yorker you say you?re sixty
years old and you?re worried about how many lives you can save?Is
that what drives you in your effort to help?

CLINTON: Yes. That sounds sort of morbid. The tone in which I said
was almost whimsical and humorous. This is what I love to do it?s
what I think I should do. I?ve had a wonderful. I got to be
president. I?ve lived the life of my dreams. I dodged a bullet
with that health thing. I think I owe it to my fellow countrymen
and people around the world to help save lives and help people
see the future. But as it happens I love it. I feel it?s a great
gift. I feel it?s a rewarding way to spend my life.

WALLACE: Someone asked you ?he asked you if you could do more good
as a former president than as a president and you said only if I
live a long time.

CLINTON: Yea that?s true.

WALLACE: how do you compare the powers of being in office and what
you can do out of office?

CLINTON: When you?re president you can operate on broader scope.
You can simultaneously work to stop the genocide in Kosovo, bring
peace to the middle east, pass a budget that gives millions of
kids a chance to have after school programs? So in other words
you?ve got a lot of different moving parts and you can move them
all at once.

But you?re also more at the mercy of events. That is 43 did not
run for President to deal with the events of 9/11 but once it
happened it wasn?t as if he had an option. Once I looked at the
economic data after I won the election, I realized I would have
to work harder to reduce the deficit and therefore have less
money in my first year to invest in things I wanted to invest in.

WALLACE: So what is it that you can do as a former president.

CLINTON: So what you can do as a former president, you don?t have
as wide a range of powers so you have to concentrate on fewer
things. But you are less at the mercy of ?events. If I say look
we?re going to work on economic empowerment of poor people, on
fighting aids and other diseases, on trying to bridge the
religious and political differences between people and on trying
to avoid the worst calamities of climate change and try to
revitalize the economy in the process, I can actually do that.
Because tomorrow when I get up and there?s a bad headline in the
papers, it?s President Bush?s responsibility and not mine. That?s
the joy of being a former potus. And it is true that if you live
long enough and have discipline in the way you do it ? like this
CGI ? you might be able to effect as many lives as you did when
president.

WALLACE: When we announced that you were going to be on fox news
Sunday, I got a lot of email from viewers, and I got to say I was
surprised most of them wanted me to ask you this question. Why
didn?t you do more to put Bin Laden and al Qaeda out of business
when you were President. There?s a new book out which I suspect
you?ve read called the Looming Tower. And it talks about how the
fact that when you pulled troops out of Somalia in 1993, Bin
Laden said I have seen the frailty and the weakness and the
cowardice of US troops. Then there was the bombing of the
embassies in Africa and the attack on the USS Cole.

CLINTON: OK..

WALLACE: ?may I just finish the question sir. And after the
attack, the book says, Bin Laden separated his leaders because he
expected an attack and there was no response. I understand that
hindsight is 20 20.

CLINTON: No let?s talk about?

WALLACE: ?but the question is why didn?t you do more, connect the
dots and put them out of business?

CLINTON: OK, let?s talk about it. I will answer all of those
things on the merits but I want to talk about the context of
which this?arises. I?m being asked this on the FOX network?ABC
just had a right wing conservative on the Path to 9/11 falsely
claim that it was based on the 911 commission report with three
things asserted against me that are directly contradicted by the
9/11 commission report. I think it?s very interesting that all
the conservative Republicans who now say that I didn?t do enough,
claimed that I was obsessed with Bin Laden. All of President
Bush?s neocons claimed that I was too obsessed with finding Bin
Laden when they didn?t have a single meeting about Bin Laden for
the nine months after I left office. All the right wingers who
now say that I didn?t do enough said that I did too much. Same
people.

They were all trying to get me to withdraw from Somalia in 1993
the next day after we were involved in black hawk down and I
refused to do it and stayed 6 months and had an orderly transfer
to the UN.

Ok, now let?s look at all the criticisms: Black hawk down,
Somalia. There is not a living soul in the world who thought that
Bin laden had anything to do with black hawk down or was paying
any attention to it or even knew al Qaeda was a growing concern
in October of 1993.

WALLACE: ?I understand?

CLINTON: No wait?no wait?Don?t tell me. You asked me why I didn?t
do more to Bin Laden. There was not a living soul?all the people
who criticized me wanted to leave the next day. You brought this
up so you get an answer.

WALLACE: I?m perfectly happy to. Bin Laden says?

CLINTON: And secondly?

WALLACE: Bin Laden says?

CLINTON: Bin laden may have said that?

WALLACE: Bin Laden says it showed the weakness of the US?

CLINTON: It would have shown the weakness if we left right away
but he wasn?t involved in that. That?s just a bunch of bull. That
was about Mohammed Adid, a Muslim war lord murdering..thousands
of Pakistani Muslim troops. We were all there on a humanitarian
mission. We had not one mission ? none ? to establish a certain
kind of Somali government or to keep anybody out. He was not a
religious fanatic.

WALLACE: But Mr. President?

CLINTON: There was no Al Qaeda?

WALLACE: ?with respect if I may. Instead of going through 93.

CLINTON: You asked you. It you brought it up.

WALLACE: May I ask a general question that you can answer. The
9/11 Commission, which you talk about, and this is what they did
say, not what ABC pretended they said?

CLINTON: Wait, Wait?

WALLACE: ?they said about you and 43 and I quote, ?The US
government took the threat seriously, not in the sense of
mustering anything like that would be?.to confront an enemy of
the first, second or third rank?

CLINTON: That?s not true with us and Bin Laden?

WALLACE: ?the 9/11 commission says?

CLINTON: Let?s look at what Richard Clarke says. You think Richard
Clarke has a vigorous attitude about Bin Laden?

WALLACE: Yes I do

CLINTON: You do?

WALLACE: I think he has a variety of opinions and loyalties but
yes.

CLINTON: He has a variety of opinion and loyalties now but let?s
look at the facts. He worked for Ronald Regan. He was loyal to
him. He worked for George Herbert Walker Bush and he was loyal to
him. He worked for me and he was loyal to me. He worked for
President Bush; he was loyal to him. They downgraded him and the
terrorist operation. Now, look what he said, read his book and
read his factual assertions ? not opinions, assertions. He said
we took vigorous action after the African embassies. We probably
nearly got Bin Laden.

WALLACE: ?

CLINTON: Now wait a minute?

WALLACE: ..cruise missiles..

CLINTON: I authorized the CIA to get groups together to try to
kill him. The CIA was run by George Tenet who President Bush gave
the medal of freedom to and said he did a good job.. The country
never had a comprehensive anti terror operation until I came to
office. If you can criticize me for one thing, you can criticize
me for this, after the Cole I had battle plans drawn to go into
Afghanistan, overthrow the Taliban, and launch a full scale
attack search for Bin Laden. But we needed baseing rights in
Uzbekistan which we got after 9/11. The CIA and the FBI refused
to certify that Bin Laden was responsible while I was there. They
refused to certify. So that meant I would have had to send a few
hundred special forces in helicopters and refuel at night. Even
the 9/11 Commission didn?t do that. Now the 9/11 Commission was a
political document too. All I?m asking is if anybody wants to say
I didn?t do enough, you read Richard Clarke?s book.

WALLACE: Do you think you did enough sir?

CLINTON: No, because I didn?t get him

WALLACE: Right?

CLINTON: But at least I tried. That?s the difference in me and
some, including all the right wingers who are attacking me now.
They ridiculed me for trying. They had eight months to try and
they didn?t?.. I tired. So I tried and failed. When I failed I
left a comprehensive anti-terror strategy and the best guy in the
country, Dick Clarke? So you did FOX?s bidding on this show. You
did you nice little conservative hit job on me. But what I want
to know..

WALLACE: Now wait a minute sir?

CLINTON:..

WALLACE: I asked a question. You don?t think that?s a legitimate
question?

CLINTON: It was a perfectly legitimate question but I want to know
how many people in the Bush administration you asked this
question of. I want to know how many people in the Bush
administration you asked why didn?t you do anything about the
Cole. I want to know how many you asked why did you fire Dick
Clarke. I want to know?

WALLACE: We asked..

CLINTON:..

WALLACE: Do you ever watch Fox News Sunday sir?

CLINTON: I don?t believe you ask them that.

WALLACE: We ask plenty of questions of?

CLINTON: You didn?t ask that did you? Tell the truth

WALLACE: About the USS Cole?

CLINTON: tell the truth.

WALLACE: I?with Iraq and Afghanistan there?s plenty of stuff to
ask.

CLINTON: Did you ever ask that? You set this meeting up because
you were going to get a lot of criticism from your viewers
because Rupert Murdoch is going to get a lot of criticism from
your viewers for supporting my work on Climate Change. And you
came here under false pretenses and said that you?d spend half
the time talking about?

WALLACE: [laughs]

CLINTON: You said you?d spend half the time talking about what we
did out there to raise $7 billion dollars plus over three days
from 215 different commitments. And you don?t care.

WALLACE: But President Clinton?

CLINTON:

WALLACE: We were going to ask half the question about it. I didn?t
think this was going to set you off on such a tear .

CLINTON: It set me off on such a tear because you didn?t formulate
it in an honest way and you people ask me questions you don?t ask
the other side.

WALLACE: Sir that is not true?

CLINTON: ?and Richard Clarke?

WALLACE: That is not true?

CLINTON: Richard Clarke made it clear in his testimony?

WALLACE: Would you like to talk about the Clinton Global
Initiative?

CLINTON: No I want to finish this.

WALLACE: Alright

CLINTON: All I?m saying is you falsely accuse me of giving aid and
comfort to Bin Laden because of what happened in Somalia. No one
knew al Qaeda existed then?

WALLACE: Did they know in 1996 when he declared war on the US? Did
no one know in 1998?

CLINTON: Absolutely they did

WALLACE: When they bombed the two embassies?

CLINTON:?

WALLACE: Or in 2000 when they hit the Cole.

CLINTON: What did I do? I worked hard to try and kill him. I
authorized a finding for the CIA to kill him. We contracted with
people to kill him. I got closer to killing him than anybody has
gotten since. And if I were still president we?d have more than
20,000 troops there trying to kill him. Now I never criticized
President Bush and I don?t think this is useful. But you know we
do have a government that think Afghanistan is 1/7 as important
as Iraq. And you ask me about terror and Al Qaeda with that sort
of dismissive theme when all you have to do is read Richard
Clarke?s book to look at what we did in a comprehensive
systematic way to try to protect the country against terror. And
you?ve got that little smirk on your face. It looks like you?re
so clever?

WALLACE: [Laughs]

CLINTON: I had responsibility for trying to protect this country.
I tried and I failed to get bin laden. I regret it but I did try.
And I did everything I thought I responsibly could. The entire
military was against sending special forces in to Afghanistan and
refueling by helicopter and no one thought we could do it
otherwise?We could not get the CIA and the FBI to certify that Al
Qaeda was responsible while I was President. Until I left office.
And yet I get asked about this all the time and they had three
times as much time to get him as I did and no one ever asks them
about this. I think that?s strange.

WALLACE: Can I ask you about the Clinton Global Initiative?

CLINTON: You can.

WALLACE: I always intended to sir.

CLINTON: No you intended to move your bones by doing this first.
But I don?t mind people asking me. I actually talked o the 9/11
commission for four hours and I told them the mistakes I thought
I made. And I urged them to make those mistakes public because I
thought none of us had been perfect. But instead of anybody
talking about those things. I always get these clever little
political?where they ask me one sided questions? It always comes
from one source. And so?

WALLACE:?

CLINTON: And so?

WALLACE: I just want to ask you about the Clinton Global
Initiative but what?s the source? You seem upset?

CLINTON: I am upset because..

WALLACE: ?and all I can say is I?m asking you in good faith
because it?s on people?s minds sir. And I wasn?t?

CLINTON: There?s a reason it?s on people?s minds. That?s the point
I?m trying to make. There?s a reason it?s on people?s minds
because they?ve done a serious disinformation campaign to create
that impression. This country only has one person who has worked
against terror?under Regan?only one, Richard Clarke. And all I?d
say anybody who wonders whether we did wrong or right. Anybody
who wants to see what everybody else did, read his book. The
people on my political right who say I didn?t do enough spent the
whole time I was president saying why is he so obsessed with Bin
Laden. And that was wag the dog when he tried to kill him. My
Republican sec of defense ? and I think I?m the only person since
World War II to have a Secretary of Defense from the opposite
party ? Richard Clarke, and all the intelligence people said that
I ordered a vigorous attempt to get Osama Bin Laden and came
closer apparently than anybody has since.

WALLACE: alright?

CLINTON: And you guys try to create the opposite impression when
all you have to do is read Richard Clarke?s findings and you know
it?s not true. It?s just not true. And all this business about
Somalia ? the same people who criticized me about Somalia were
demanding I leave the next day. Same exact crowd..

WALLACE: one of the?

CLINTON: ?So if you?re going to do this for gods sake follow the
same standards for everybody.

WALLACE: I think we do sir

CLINTON: ?be fair.

WALLACE: I think we do. One of the main parts of the global
initiative this year is religious reconciliation. President Bush
says that the fight against Islamic extremism is the central
conflict of the century and his answer is promoting democracy and
reform. Do you think he has that right?

CLINTON: Sure. To advocate democracy and reform in the Muslim
world? Absolutely. I think the question is what?s the best way to
do it. I think also the question is how do you educate people
about democracy. Democracy is about way more than majority rule.
Democracy is about minority rights, individual rights, restraints
on power. And there?s more than one way to advance democracy but
do I think on balance that in the end after several bouts of
instability do I think it would be better if we had more freedom
and democracy? Sure I do. ?The president has a right to do it?
Sure I do. But I don?t think that?s all we can do in the Muslim
world. I think they have to see us try to get a just and
righteous peace in the Middle East. They have to see us as
willing to talk to people who see the world differently than we
do.

WALLACE: Last year at this conference you got 2.5 billion in
commitments, pledges, how did you do this year?

CLINTON: Well this year we had 7.3 billion as of this morning.

WALLACE: 7..excuse me?

CLINTON: 7.3 billion as of this morning. 3 billion of that is.
That?s over a multi-year. These are at most 10 year commitments.
That came from Richard Branson?s commitment to give all his
transportation profits to clean energy investments. But still
that?s over 4 billion. And we will have another 100 commitments
and probably raise another billion dollars. We have a lot of
commitments still in process.

WALLACE: When you look at the 3 billion from Branson plus billions
that Gates is giving and Warren Buffet, what do you make of this
age of philanthropy?

CLINTON: I think that for one thing really rich people have always
given money away. They?ve endowed libraries and things like that.
The unique thing about this age is first of all you have a lot of
people like Bill Gates and Warren Buffet who are interested in
issues around the world that grow out of the nature of the 21st
century and its inequalities ? the income inequalities, the
education inequalities, the health care inequalities. You get a
guy like Gates who built Microsoft and he actually believes that
he can help overcome all of the health disparities in the world.
That?s the first thing. Second thing?there are a lot of people
with average incomes who are joining me because of the Internet.
Take the tsuami for example we had 1.3 billion dollars given?.by
households. The third things you have all these NGO that you can
partner with along with the government. So all these things
together mean that people with real money in ways that help
people that before would have been only the object of government
grants and loans.

WALLACE: I know we?re over but can I ask you two political
questions. Let?s talk some politics. In that same New Yorker
article you say you?re tired of Karl Rove?s BS. I? m cleaning up
what you said.

CLINTON: I also say I?m not tired of Karl Rove. I don?t blame Karl
Rove. If you?ve got a deal that works you just keep on doing it.

WALLACE: So what is the BS?

CLINTON: well every even number year right before an election they
come up with some security issue. In 2000 right before the
election ?In 2002 our party supported them in undertaking weapon
inspections in Iraq and were 100% behind them in Afghanistan and
they didn?t have any way to make us look like we didn?t care
about terror. And so they decided they would?the homeland
security bill that they opposed and they put some pill in it that
we wouldn?t pass like taking the job rights away from 170,000
people and then say that we were weak on terror if we weren?t for
it? This year I think they wanted to make the question of
prisoner treatment and intercepted communications the same sort
of issue until John Warner came and Lindsey Graham got in there
and it turns out there were some Republicans who believe in the
constitution and their convictions?some ideas about how best to
fight terror.

As long as the American people believe that we take this seriously
and we may have our differences over Iraq but I think we?ll do
fine this election. Even if they agree with us about the Iraq war
we could be hurt by Karl Rove?s new foray if we don?t make it
clear that we care about the security of this country. We want to
implement the 9/11 commission recommendations which they haven?t
in four years. We want to?Afghanistan against Bin Laden. We want
to make America more energy independent. If they want to talk
about Iraq say what they really want about Iraq.

But Rove is good and why I honor him?I?ve always been amused by
how good he is. But on the other hand this is perfectly
predictable. We?re going to win a lot of seats if the American
people aren?t afraid. If they?re afraid and we get divided again
then we?ll only win a few seats.

WALLACE: Do you think the White House and the Republicans want to
make the American people afraid.

CLINTON: Of course they do. They want another homeland security
bill and they want to make it not about Iraq but some other
security issue. Where if we disagree with them we are by
definition endangering the security of the country. And it?s a
big load of huey. We?ve got 9 Iraq war veterans running for House
Seats. President Reagan?s Secretary of the Navy is the democratic
candidate for Senate in Virginia. A three star admiral who was on
my NSC staff ? who also fought terror by the way ? is running for
the seat of Kurt Weldon?s in Pennsylvania. We?ve got a huge
military presence in this campaign and you can?t let them have
some rhetorical device that puts us in a box that we don?t belong
in. That?s their job. Their job is to beat us. But our job is to
not let them get away with it and if we don;?t we?ll be fine.

WALLACE: Mr. President thank you for one of the more unusual
interviews.
[end]

They will have to edit the shit out of this to make Wallace look
anything close to good.


-- 
"Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to
stand by the president or any other public official save exactly
to the degree in which he himself stands by the country. It is
patriotic to support him insofar as he efficiently serves the
country. It is unpatriotic not to oppose him to the exact extent
that by inefficiency or otherwise he fails in his duty to stand
by the country." --- President Theodore Roosevelt
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