Text 15568, 341 rader
Skriven 2014-05-23 18:46:19 av Roy Witt (1:387/22)
  Kommentar till text 15554 av John Guillory (102.mlfidonews)
Ärende: Voting (new voting sytem
================================
Greetings John!

 RW>> I wouldn't know, as the software I'm using knows where everything
 RW>> goes.

 JG>      Stay away from Mystic then!

Well, unlike yourself, I know where to find the docs and who to ask for
help.

 RW>> I do too, but there was a tradition that stopped with his election
 RW>> as RC...And as a R18 resident of Mississippi, he should be willing
 RW>> to step aside.

 JG> Marc's in Alabama, but I think that's Region 18 as well...

Obviously.

 RW>> I have no problems with Marc, he's more than once bailed me out by
 RW>> helping to build net387 back to at least being again, after it was
 RW>> killed by Matt Bedynek.

 JG>      I have no problems being moved to R18, and I'm sure Marc
 JG> wouldn't mind
 JG>      being moved to R18 either.

I think he does, because the former New Orleans net would have a R18 net
number.

 JG> As I said, I really didn't even notice that I was in the wrong region
 JG> until earlier this month or so.  But then again I really don't think
 JG> it was my responsibility alone to know that I was in the wrong
 JG> region.

So you're like McJeerkey, you don't know shit from Shinola...

 JG>   I could always request to be re-located to
 JG> region
 JG>      18.  Let's see.  I could talk to my NC about it, but he should
 JG> be in
 JG>      R18 as well.  I could ask the R19 to talk to the R18 and find
 JG> the
 JG>      appropriate net.  But then again... My NC is the RC.  I guess I
 JG> could
 JG>      ask the R18 coordinator what he thinks about the situation.
 JG> But,
 JG>      if the ZC wants marc to be RC19, I suppose he'd inform RC18 that
 JG> he
 JG>      wants things to stay the same.

All conjecture on your part, but none of it is per Fidonet policy.

 JG> Under the circumstances, if the
 JG> Z1C
 JG>      wants marc as a RC19, then I'm pretty sure he'd want me to stay
 JG> in
 JG>      Net396 out of fear that moving me would cause marc to move in an
 JG>      in-direct fashion.  Though I do appreciate a little discovery on
 JG> why
 JG>      the situation is approached as is...

I find Marc to be very cooperative in that way. But if a node is located
in R19 and gets moved unilatterally by an NC/RC who hasn't informed you of
the circumstances around that move, he's not doing a very good job.

 RW>> Matt.

 JG>      That name sounds a bit familiar ... Might be who I was thinking
 JG> of...

Matt Bedynek was RC when I moved to Texas, ten years ago. He wouldn't
allow me to have a RIN, when he knew full well that there was no net in
San Antonio at the time. Instead, he forced me to choose a net, either
in Austin or Brownsville, TX. Both of which have since gone bellyup.

 RW>> Still, you and Marc live in R18, thus the net number should reflect
 RW>> that and the RC18 asked to include it in his region.

 JG>      Maybe I should contact him.  Still.... I don't want Marc to get
 JG> upset
 JG>      with me for wanting to transfer...

I wouldn't want you to upset him by asking stupid questions. You should
inquire of the circumstances, get an answer and then pose your question.

 RW>> It matters to a lot of R19 sysops, because we don't have a RC to
 RW>> represent what R19 as a whole wants.

 JG>      There once was a stir about not having elections in a while, and
 JG> Marc
 JG>      held a NetCoord election.  I believe he stayed in... He seemed
 JG> willing
 JG>      to have an election any time someone believed there needed to be
 JG> one.

An NC election is quite different than holding an RC election. A net
election only deals with the local sysops, while an RC election has to
deal with every sysop in the region. Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana and
Oklahoma.

 JG>      Perhaps if Marc was to not win the election again, then the ZC
 JG> would
 JG>      prefer him to move to R18, where he could then have a shot of
 JG> being
 JG>      the RC18?

Yes, but she won't recuse herself from an R19C election.  That's the
history of the last attempt to have an RC election here. And in spite of
her stating that there were three, NOT. Marc was elected, he wasn't
challanged again until, I think it was 2010.

 JG> But then again, what if there is an election and he
 JG> wins?

If he's a sysop residing in R18, he can't run as RC19...

 JG>      And this brings up some serious questions on the legality of the
 JG> election.
 JG>      I'd have to read up on the old documents about how this is
 JG> handled....
 JG>      In the region election, Marc's a NC, so technically he gets a
 JG> vote,

Well, he'd get a vote if he wanted to remain NC of a net located in R18,
but he wouldn't be elegible to run for RC19.

 JG>  but
 JG>      is he allowed to vote for his self as a RC?

Irrelevant.

 JG> Seems he could skew
 JG> the
 JG>      ballet box a bit by electing his self....

Also irrelevant, since he can't run for RC19. He could run for R18C, if
that region held an RC election.

 JG>   Then there's the
 JG> question
 JG>      of who counts the ballets, etc. If it'd be me, in order to prove
 JG> all
 JG>      fairness, I'd go leaps and bound beyond by ensuring the person
 JG> counting
 JG>      the ballets was in no way effected by the results.

Whale, Joe Delehaye has been trusted to run elections in Z2, so that could
work here.

 JG> Eg. if I was
 JG> a NC
 JG>      and I held an election, I'd contact someone outside the net,
 JG> perhaps
 JG>      in another region to have all the sysop's send their votes to,
 JG> and

Actually there's a much easier way to do that. Have candidates be
nominated in a neutral echo, each one accepting the nomination's second.

Have an election coordinator be the only vote counter by acking the 2nding
of the nomination and added to the ballot.

 JG>      allow that person to post the results.  This way, no one could
 JG> say
 JG>      the election was rigged!  I used to be a NC, and in other nets
 JG> was
 JG>      a useless NC/RC and such... I say useless because SysopTechNet
 JG> has
 JG>      many 1-person Nets and regions.

We have a RIN in Arkansas that is the only sysop in that state. RINs get a
vote, at least they did in R10 where I was listed as a RIN. As an election
coordinator, I'd ask the sysops present if that would be ok with them.

 JG> And another net I was in, I was
 JG>      the NC, but rather than forward the app to me to set them up,
 JG>      RC would forward everything to me to add to the list, then tell
 JG> me
 JG>      he already added it, so basically I did nothing there... My time
 JG> as
 JG>      a NC in fidonet ages ago was not much more than just configuring
 JG>      makenl to pretty much send the nodelist segment to the RC.  I
 JG> never
 JG>      got any new request, or changes, etc.  So wasn't much
 JG> maintenance there.

8^)

 RW>> LOL! I hear that! i.e. a ZC shouldn't be involved in distributing
 RW>> echomail, but there's an exception to the rule, for the zone admin.

 RW>> If Starr had a RC who knew how to handle that problem, the net
 RW>> wouldn't have gone away. OTH, Marc maintained my listing when a
 RW>> problem was found in one of my netsegs and he used an old one kept
 RW>> as a backup.

 JG>      Sounds good... I suppose a batch file could be made to setup a
 JG> safe
 JG>     keeping of things...

Once you run the compiler, you'll know if there's a problem with your
segment. That is how Marc knew of mine. He then submitted his compiled
regseg and notified me to edit my netseg. Now that the ZC is compiling a
daily nodelist, mine was corrected a few days later.

 RW>> Well, I'm not that loose with my politics. If you're not doing the
 RW>> job I would prefer you do, then you're outta here. I wish it were
 RW>> that easy to dump the dumbass in the WH today.

 JG>      So you have no problem dumping the entire senate and house of
 JG> represenatives?

I'd have no problem with dumping the bottle neck. Harry Reid would rather
talk about the renaming of a baseball team because it is polically
incorrect to use 'Redskins' than talk about freeing a US Marine who is
captive in a Mexican prison. All the Marine did was try to turn around at
the border, but the highway system there wouldn't allow him to cross
several lanes to get to the 'To USA lane'. He tried to be diplomatic about
it and the Mexican border guards were going to help him get in the 'to
USA' lane, but the Mexican federal police got wind of it and put him in
custody for carrying firearms in his truck.

 RW>> Well, we do have that now. We have people stompin' their feet to
 RW>> drop Z4 out of the nodelist, because they don't seem to understand
 RW>> Spanish when they speak perfectly good Porteguese. Not to mention
 RW>> that they're English is as broken as Fidel Castros.

 JG>      I used to work with some Jamacians... I had a phone plan that
 JG> allowed
 JG>     free longdistance to Jamaica..  I had them call me up on the
 JG> phone, I'd
 JG>     go 3-way and call their parents in Jamaica... Every so often, I'd
 JG> listen
 JG>     and if they wasn't talking, I'd hang up the phone.  One day, I
 JG> picked
 JG>     up and could swear every other word they said was the F word!  I
 JG> thought
 JG>     she must have been upset beyond belief at who she was talking to.
 JG>     That was her husband, and she was speaking what she called
 JG> 'broken english'

LOL! She was telling you the truth.

 RW>> No more Z5 or Z6, no more IC because he turned into a nut job and
 RW>> was deposed by the gang of ZCs, aka the ZCC. That last C stands for
 RW>> Council.

 JG>      Yup, gone is the 'ozone', and now the z5...

 RW>> I'm all for that.

 Kq>>> Planet:Continent::State/County::City:Street/Address:bbsnumber
 RW>> Nahhhh. Zone,Region,and Net is good enough. The shorter the better.
 RW>> Too damned complicated.

 JG>      Intentionally over-board...

 RW>> That sounds like our former IC...he made his own policy and when
 RW>> that didn't work, he re-wrote it again.

 JG>      Yeah, I remember basically how he got in, how he was not wanted,
 JG> etc.
 JG>      I know that as far as Z1 was concerned, he was out, and they
 JG> assumed
 JG>      someone else was IC.  Z2 assumed he was God and emperor of IC.
 JG>      As far as Z2 was concerned no one else's opinion mattered
 JG> anyway.
 JG>      You know, I'd venture to say Z2 could be cleared out quickly if
 JG> enough
 JG>      policy complaints where filed and enough complaints the the Z2C
 JG> where
 JG>      filed to force the NC's of various nets in Z2 and RC's in z2 to
 JG> do
 JG>      their job and ensure the nodes played by the rules...

You would have to do better than that. They need a ZC who doesn't play
political games with their nodelistings. Get rid of the 1 sysop, 1 RC
regions and the same with their nets. Get a true indication of what they
have and take the Russian contingency out of Z2 and give them their own,
R7 region.

Or better yet, hold a zone wide election for ZC and make it mandatory that
someone besides the present ZC run for the position. Then we'd have a
Russian for ZC2...


 JG>   Granted,
 JG> I've
 JG>      not had a reason to file a complaint with any Z2 node yet, but I
 JG> do
 JG>      know that China is notoriously known for trying to hack
 JG> Synchronet BBS's
 JG>      and linux systems!

Well, that has nothing to do with Fidonet, since Z6 died some years ago
and what was left was merged into Z3.

 JG> I think next time I detect one hacking my
 JG> system,
 JG>      I'm going to search the nodelist for their domain name and see
 JG> if
 JG>      it's a Z2 BBS.

Whoosh! I know from your wedding picture that you're a tall man, but there
are no Fidonet sysops in China anymore, at least none that are listed as
such.

 JG> If so, file a complaint with the NC for trying
 JG> to
 JG>      cause harm to another BBS!  Enough of that and I'm sure that Z2
 JG> won't
 JG>      be able to claim they're the biggest segment any more.

They never did.

 JG>      I get the impression China's a lot like a third world country or
 JG> so.
 JG>      So far behind on times, despite the fact that they're a large
 JG> supplier
 JG>      of electronics, the people that live there don't have the money
 JG> for the
 JG>      products they export.  That's why they have such a huge segment.
 JG> They're
 JG>      just discovering what a computer is and how BBS's work....

Actually, the Chinese are more on top of how all of this works than anyone
in the world, except maybe the Russians. They're given credit or blame,
which ever you prefer in the hacking of military, banking and private
industry computers, world wide.

Your best bet is to run a firewall in your router and a backup of a
firewall on your PC...a virus scanner software and anything else you can
do to keep them out.

    Have a day!

         R\%/itt - K5RXT

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